Relationships between women and priests have always been clandestine. It’s never an easy subject to discuss. Most people prefer secrecy. But another aspect which we have never discussed is the issue of the effect of making love – children.
Priests are more likely to have children as they are not experienced in birth control methods. Besides their love making is hidden and done quickly.
Maybe hiding a love relationship between adults is one thing, but hiding from children is totally devastating! How can a father not see, caress, accompany, play and spend time with his child?
That is why we’ve been against secrecy from day one. Once everything is covered in great secrecy, one can expect that lateral secrets will be kept under great scrutiny from the Catholic Church.
Speaking about the truth will make everybody free. Yet in some quarters in the Catholic Church they still prefer to keep a lid on all secrets. It has taken some victims great courage to come forward and tell their hidden stories.
Obviously some of them were looked upon like sinners. They were given all sorts of names. But those seeking the truth listened to their incredible stories.
The best part of it is that children are a living proof of the love between the woman and the priest. On the other hand, when they’ll discover who their true father is, they realise that they have been robbed of a normal life. They can’t tell who their true father was. Most probably they have been taught to lie. Like in real life all lies come to an end one day or another. Yet this time the child is practically left without a trail. He/she would like to know her father, yet secrecy and contradictory reports prevent all this.
Besides the story of the hidden father, the church fails its people as it goes against its fundamental moral teaching. He who is a paternal father should be held responsible and make sure of helping the mother. This not only on financial matters but rather in giving support to the mother and by being present in the child’s life. One cannot simply tell the mother to go and hide herself!
In some cases, the priest tried in a private manner to convince the woman to have an abortion in order to hide his adventure. In some cases, the woman died as they were conducting abortion in clinics which were not up-to-standard, by they promised anonymity.
It all shows that some members of the church go to great heights in order to cover these secrets. Yet somebody has to speak out in order to denounce the ugly face of celibacy when it is forced on priests!
Now people who are not afraid to speak out would be helping the church in keeping her secrets hidden from the common people. In fact when they force people to shut up, it means that they are afraid! We are the ones who should feel proud because we are helping the church to come out and be transparent. It will be more Christ like but less of an institution.
We are proud on this blog that together with readers we’re uncovering some of the secrets held by priests who try to gag women. Others become very violent or life threatening to the woman they made love with!
Please help us by publishing your story to prove that the effects of forced celibacy are not light and they are not ‘just a few of them’.
The priest I had a relationship with has a son (for what I know- I don’t know if he has more than one) with a woman that lives in another country. It was not him who told me but other sources. When I confronted him on this he always denied or never admitted. Of course he is not faithful to this woman: after some days he started a relationship with me, he went “on vacation” (he said to visit some relatives) and while he was facetiming me I heard a child crying in the background. I asked him who the child was and he said he was a relative’s son. After we split up, I discovered the that was his son. This woman was calling him all the time even when I was with him and he said that she was his sister calling him. Besides me, he had other affairs even with married parishioners. I informed all his other women that he was having a relationship with me too but no one of them broke up with him.
I wonder also how can this women be some doormats who bear everything from him.
As you said he became very violent and threatening to my life.
I think that children are not the proof of LOVE, they are the proof of sex.
Mary2, in this case. Yes the child is proof of sex. But we can’t say that the child is not of love. All children are a blessing and gift from God. No matter the sin their parents commit. Certainly, that child is loved by his mother. I am sorry to hear that your priest did this and is doing this. He has a responsibility to the child. He is actually only hurting himself in this. He should have committed to the child’s mother.
We can not keep secrets as a church. This is what ruins the church. The Holy Spirit can only do so much, we also have a responsibility. These priests and our church need to see that leaving a trail of human emotional wreckage is not ok. Under no circumstance. IT is time. The TIME is now.
@B:
let’s stay out from romanticism, illusion and fairytale realm and let’s stay focused on reality. Not all children are generated out of love, let’s say the majority of them are not generated out of love. The sins their parents commit influence their whole lives and often the chain continues until someone courageous in the generation breaks it. That’s the reality.
This priest is not hurting himself. He is a narcissist. He hurts all the other people he enters in contact with. And he feeds on stupid women, including his son’s mother, that enable him.
@B~
You write with the *voice* of a priest~ I hope you are a priest!
~Marshmallow
Yes, it sounds like B is a priest….
B
Which stance do you prefer?
Holding priests accountable, or protecting their feelings?
It can’t be both ways in many circumstances.
@Nikki,
I think I have made my opinion clear in several other feeds on this blog.
To be clear:
1. I do believe the priest should be held accountable for his actions, I also believe he should marry the woman to whom he has sired a child with. I do believe the church should allow this to occur. The church should allow him to marry and still be a priest.
Now whatever scenario you want to throw in, does not hinder my opinion that the priest should be held accountable AS WELL AS the woman:
1. If he has had an affair with a married woman and sired a child, he still should be held accountable. He still needs to take responsibility.
2. If the woman does not want to marry him. (This would make me question her “in love theory” and her motives in general –which breaks my heart) HE STILL SHOULD TAKE RESPONSIBILITY AND BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.
IF, and I say IF, as in (I really doubt it) that in this particular case that is mentioned about the Archbishop of the Diocese “knowing” of this priests behavior and the “proof” has been provided and it is reported “nothing has been done.” Then the Archdiocese has done their own investigation and have found the accusations to be false or malicious OR INDEED they have turned a blind eye.
IF in the case of a blind eye, I suggest a more public forum to which the Archbishop will be forced to take action. As well as going above his head, because their is a chain of command. Also, these woman could file a joint legal suit of sexual harassment against the priest.
But, the women involved will have to put themselves out there. Which I am not sure that they would want to?
@B
Actually I found your “awww Nikki” comment from the previous feed and subsequent comments somewhat perplexing. In particular your comment about”slinging at their body parts”
This came across to me as overly defensive and thus contradicts your others about holding them accountable.
Good to know you believe inappropriate behaviour on all counts should be addressed.
That is unbelievable. He wasn’t a priest. He certainly doesn’t deserve to be given any respect. I hope yr receiving counselling. It’s truly shocking.
He opened my mind to reality. It was shocking but he awakened me from the illusion many people are mired in. He made me see hypocrisy, manipulation and madness in all its extent. That’s the only good thing he has done.
Mary2~
I am sorry you experienced this, and his other women as well. Clearly, there is something terribly wrong with this guy~ a predator. The only positive is you have left him.
Is his Bishop aware of all this?
Prayers for you, Mary2.
Marshmallow
And, Mary2~
I wholeheartedly agree with you about the illusions *practicing* Catholics carry
regarding the priesthood. That same illusion is sometimes presented on this blog as well~ excuse-making and doting over clearly nasty (priest) men who abuse women.
The abuse I took, too, was a pivotal marker in my life as a Catholic. And worse, my heart hardened. Better than it was, but what a Hell he put me through! Amen, he’s history!
~Marshmallow
Well many women say that he was history….yet they keep thinking, writing on the their ex-lover. Most probably many women would need therapy in order to completely heal from their emotional wounds. Let’s look forward. Although we accept the greatest historical error from the Catholic Church, let’s move forward. Pope Francis is in favour of mercy. He is the first Pope to accept resignations from Bishops (because of abuses), so he is not simply discarding the bad past. Yet if we don’t practice mercy, we’re going to be slaves of the past.
@Marshmallow:
The Bishop is aware of my story and all the other women…I don’t know if he is aware of the son. But he doesn’t care e did nothing to him, leaving him to continue with his double-triple-threefold-fourfold….life. That are the facts.
@Daniel:
yes we say it’s history but we don’t forget. How could you forget? I write about him for other women to know and to learn from others’ experiences.
I cannot have mercy to people who haven’t had even a crumb of mercy for me. I don’t get revenge either. I just learn and try not to indulge in other mistakes against my own self.
The fact that I saw him in his true nature gives me freedom and he has no more power over me. Him and all the other people like him, priests or not.
If you survive a situation, the best revenge is to LEARN and CHANGE and regain power.
@marshmallow:
I know Catholics ( beware, it’s not only restricted to Catholics but it’s a common attitude in ALL religions, groups, associations ecc…) who even defend pedophiles saying that you don’t have to judge. Their life is so empty that they, like a flock of sheeps, don’t know where to go without a shepherd so they defend their shepherds even if they are wolves. When someone says something like that, I walk away and don’t want to have anything to share with this person. That’s insanity.
My heart hardened too. I just learnt to protect myself. To determine my own life.
@Mary2~
I agree with you a hundredfold on all the points you have made.
And mercy for abusive priests? Like you, I think not as well. These men~ who do not show any sign of remorse is one thing~ but how does one extend mercy to he who continues to repeat their heinous behavior? I have failed to see any good in that. Let
alone encourage other women to.
The romanticism that women often extend these stories is baffling at best, and I have experienced harsh, disrespectful responses from a handful of commenters who became incensed because I will not give false hope to nearly every story that comes onto this blog that are filled with abominable behavior. Even women who are kept in secret are being used by the priest. Celibacy is not the entire problem, *but* The Church supporting these priests and women coddling these guys *are* the problem! Telling our unvarnished story is essential because these men do not belong with women *or* active ministry. Thank you, Mary2 for your candidness!
In my life, I have found that healthy men who loved me dropped what they were doing, chased me, treated me with respect, wanted physical love, and then asked me to commit to them. Old-fashioned, but that has been my experience as well as that of nearly every woman I know~ no matter the education, financial or career of the man. Men who are healthy do not use women, they do not hide us or make us second choice; they do not treat their woman like property, nor do they reel them in and cast them out while claiming affection or love for the woman. It’s just the way *normal* men operate.
I went to counseling, take an anti-depressant and still see a spiritual director to get a grip on the torment from my priest. Healing is still a work-in- progress.
I wish you and all women who have been used by a priest the best of God’s love~ especially the will to walk away.
~Marshmallow
Daniel..my compliments to you on yet another great story article. Yes,,there have always been children of priests..the sad thing,,is the children suffer from all the horrible ”forced celibacy” on priests. They,,the children were the reason centuries ago,,they made up this horrible inhumane,,unnatural and unblblical man made rule..of mandatory celibacy..when it used to be…”optional celibacy” for priests. The church did not want the priests to leave their inheritance to their wives and children..they wanted it for themselves to create a big rich empire!! Shame on them!! Well it only created” filth” in our church. It sure is about time mandatory celibacy becomes ”optional” again. Believe me..the church keeps saying..they can’t afford celibate married priests…Baloney!! They sure can..they have enough money…they just want to keep it for themselves..especially the big sharks..like cardinals and bishops. Well..soon it will come to an end. Blessings to all!!!!
Maria, I agree with you. The mandatory celibacy has led to perverse decisions. Or should I say, Chaos. And we all know who the master of chaos is.
Well said, Maria!
Thank You~
Marshmallow
Last month over here upstate NY, another priest’s body was exhumed to prove he fathered a child 72 years ago!
What lengths some go to to cover the truth, only to have or unravel sooner or later.
Yes, agreed! Secrecy is the bedrock of Priesthood.
I know of a woman my age (65), in my diocese~ a small diocese, too~ whose biological father was a priest.
Her mother was married and had a large family and husband and fell in love and had a life-long affair with the priest; the husband raised this woman “as his” to some degree. The priest, though, provided monetary support including her tuition to a Catholic High School.
The priest did offer to leave the priesthood; the mother did not want to harm her other children and husband nor take him away from ministry.
They remained lovers until the day he drew his last breath; in fact, his last few years in a nursing home 60 miles from her did not keep her away. She visited him every other day making that drive as an eighty-something lady.
The daughter suffered: While the priest would attend all her events, there was never, not once, a public or private acknowledgement to her as *his* daughter. (Shame on her mother for continuing with such a deal.)
This woman has struggled with alcoholism her entire adult life and three marriages, loss of custody of her children, employment difficulties all stemming from: rejection and shame~ shame *she* should not carry that created this addiction. She is no longer a practicing Catholic.
Prayers are welcome.
You don’t agree with this woman….you have every right. Yet let’s not pass on to condemnation. Yes apparently we don’t approve of the woman’s action not to make her priest acknowledge of his daughter. Yet we never know the whole story so we are not in a position to judge. Who knows why the woman took that step? Please remember that when people write personal stories, they can’t put into writing all the thoughts, experiences, character, emotions involved!
May God Bless you all!
This woman’s husband must be very gullible…look at the situation: husband being faithful to an unfaithful woman raising child who’s not his and woman being faithful and running after a guy who is unfaithful and not his.
The result explained everything. Their daugher is an addict and no longer a practising Catholic: if as Jesus said ” the tree is recognizable by the fruit”, we can recognize how the good of a tree this system is.
@Fr Daniel~
Yes, I agree it is difficult to give advice given the somewhat limited info we are provided.
In this case, “condemnation” is over-stated; I merely stated “shame on the mother”; I continue to stand by that. The daughter was forced to carry enormous shame as an “illegitimate” child that society *and* parishioners cast upon her. She did not expect a relationship with her father, the priest; but, him dropping her an occasional note or a whisper during the hand-shake after Mass would have done wonders. This daughter was never truly recognized by her mother’s husband who raised her, either~ another swat.
There is an assumption among women~ both mothers with children and those who are spiritual mothers~ that we will prevent and stand-in for any pain we are able to so that our children do not suffer needlessly. This mother did not do that. I did not judge their love for who am I to do that~ myself having loved a priest. But, to continue the *affair* that brought a lifetime of pain and focus on a child IS shameful; shame is *not* condemnation.
I know the entire story~ an extraordinary example of priesthood and love with monumental consequences that inflicted the innocent~ a burden no child should carry. The mother/ mistress was my former mother-in-law, and the priest’s daughter is the half-sister of my former husband, and yet a wonderful sister-in-law to me. The *father*~ a former priest of my parish, as well.
~Marshmallow
The fathering of children. Many men have done this. Many have abandoned the child and the mother. Many. Many who were NOT priests. (think for a minute about how this fact made you feel, can you think of a situation like this?) Yes.
It just so happens that this forum is talking about men who happen to be priests. This is very sad, the very men who want to teach God’s laws and ways are abandoning one of the first and most sacred things of being a man. Fatherhood. These priests who have done this have fractured the credibility of the priesthood.
How can they be father’s to their parish, if they can’t be father’s to their actual children??
We must allow them to marry.
We must allow them to do what is right. What is just. And continue to be Priest. This is a living testimony to God’s way, to Christ’s way…
God called all men to the priesthood, ALL His sons. All to be heads and shepherds of the home.
Our RC priests who have fathered children, know this and learn this.
No one can “make” you do something. But, things happen…
We must allow them to marry. And continue to be Priest.
How can you lead, if you- yourself (the priest) are not living by example?
The woman in this story, her decision to just remain “lovers” while she was married to another man. That is the very thing our church warns us not to do, as well as the holy word of God. The shame, the broken psyche, the emotional immaturity, the narcissistic patterns…it is a cycle
If the church can “forgive” pedophiles and homosexuals for their “mistakes” and allow them to continue to be priests.
Why can’t the church allow heterosexual priests who fall in love with adult women get married and continue to be priests.
My heart aches today
We cannot judge this case because we weren’t there when they lay in each other’s arms discussing their hopes and dreams. We weren’t there when they were in their private moments or when they discussed that she was pregnant. We weren’t there when they consoled each other because their hearts were broken at the prospect of not being able to be together or to raise their child together. We weren’t there when they made what was likely the most difficult decision of their lives.
@Cat:
but I was there when he hid from me that he was a father. I was there when he was having sex with me while she was calling him and he said it was his sister calling. I was even there when I informed her that while she was calling I was having sex with his son’s father. I just found it was fair to inform the woman which kind of sick man she chose. Still she is with him, like many women who have no respect for themselves and put up with everything the man does.
What hopes? What dreams? What difficult moment of their lives? This is a predator. Plain and simple. Let’s stop living romance, sentimentalistic illusions.
This recent story is about a man from Buffalo.
His parents were very much in love and ran away to NYC to be together, only to be followed by private investigators by her husband and dragged back. Realize how long ago this was. The priest ultimately went back to his order and they were forced apart.
Two ppl who loved each other with a child lived their apart, it happens!
The church would never admit that he was the father,only ONE priest helped him with documents to help piece it all together.
So here he is all these years later having to take such drastic measures to confirm his rightful birth father all because this church is unwilling to accept love is real and it happens to many whom are blessed with it , including priests.
@Mary@ and Nikki~
Yes, here are two innocent lives that have been indelibly marked by The Church, true. But more markedly betrayed by two selfish priests and two women who failed their children.
~Marshmallow
“Only to be followed by private ‘investigators’ by her husband to be dragged back.”
“they were forced apart”
ehhh… Really?
@B
72 years ago….yes really.
@B~
I will keep my notes brief for now, but know that I feel your passion and can hear the
ache of your heart. Very grateful you are here among us, and your gift of wisdom, charity
and the *divinity* you express are greatly appreciated.
God Bless You~
~Marshmallow
I’m working with a girl that her fiance left the priesthood. He told her most priests don’t even consider the idea of being a priest and also getting married. He told her ‘No ” you can’t do both. They seem to know this to the core. Hence no feedback from priests.
Why don’t you give them our blog to read?
They are in our prayers for sure. They need a lot of encouragement and help.
May God bless them both!
Lucy,
That is because it is presented in the Roman Catholic rite as a ultimatum. They are lead to believe that by agreeing to the vow of celibacy; that they are making the choice. That is when the choice is made for them.
It’s a YES or NO.
1. If NO, then run along somewhere else and serve God and the church in a “lower” capacity.
2. Priest also plays into a mans desire to “save” or be the “hero”. He really believes he is “saving” souls and sacrificing himself for those souls. Naively forgetting or dismissing the fact that only God decides and ONLY Jesus Christ saves souls and we are at the most holy and just MERCY of God alone. (The hero concept is also seen with military men or men who desire to join the military.) It deeply seated in the male. As it should be. Man is the protector, provider, the shelter.
3. Some are still so young. They have had very little to no experience in the affairs of love or the heart.
4. They already feel they “don’t fit” in the secular world. (They really don’t. Because God sets his men and women apart)
5. Some give up on ever finding love and think “oh this is what God must want”
6. It is very true that the RC rite in the west has attracted homosexuals, but not just because they want to vow celibacy to avoid sin, but because it is a all male environment to which they can freely “play”.
This list could go on and on ..
Does any of this make sense?
B
You have reiterated many points supporting the dynamics of priesthood.
However number 4 is very telling.
We all belong to God and no one is set above anyone else.
That kind of reinforcement is misleading.
Jesus died and sacrificed once and for all.
Is B a priest?
Or maybe a nun?
Whilst most people never reveal their true identity, we wish to identify somebody as a priest or nun. I think it’s not fair. Maybe the person doesn’t want to be identified as such. Let’s keep our blog safe for who wish to write an opinion and never force anybody to identify himself or herself!
@Daniel:
actually, to be sincere, it didn’t even cross my mind to wonder if someone here is a priest or not. When another person (I think Marshmallow) noticed that maybe by the writing style he was a priest, I started to pay attention. Before I didn’t even think about it.
Also Daniel it’s quite weird (and a little inconsistent) that you made a whole post about priests contributing to write in the blog and after that almost complained that no priest wrote anything, and now you tell that it’s not fair to ask the identity. Also if the person doesn’t want to reveal their identity, no one forces them or threatens or blackmails them.
Yes I would like people to be open and tell their stories. That’s what I did personally. On the other hand most of the readers don’t want to tell their real names. Others still refuse to share their personal dramas to the blog. In this context it’s very unfair to ask others to reveal their true identity!
Fr Daniel~
I am to blame for starting the *wonder* about @B; please look back.
You are 100% right about keeping one’s anonymity~for each of us no matter what our life station might be, and I will embrace that. Clergy and Religious ~ including you~ just have a special something in your thoughts *and* your writing style; it is not “of the world” and visibly stands apart from lay persons. “Once a priest/nun, always a priest/nun”!
The thought of a priest, a sister or nun contributing to the blog is exciting, and I do not want to rupture their comfort zone. My apology.
~Marshmallow
@Daniel:
yes, I told you I don’t really care anything about people’s identity and I didn’t ask them to reveal their identity under threatening.
@Marshmallow
Thank you.
I have no idea why the Lord has chosen me for this particular mission.
But, here I am. Take me Lord! ❤
May the God of Israel rise up in your mind and the Lion of Judah swell in your heart, may every scale be removed from your ears, eyes, and mouth. Amen
These complications wouldn’t arise if the Catholic Church accepted married priesthood. It’s like one sin leads us to another and another and another and so on..
@M,
EXACTLY!!!! ❤
Father Daniel, can I send you an email?
Thank you.
I’ve sent you a private email. Please check your spam folder too.
May God Bless you!
Hi Father Daniel. Can I send you an email? Hope it is ok. Thank you.
I’ve sent you a private email. Please check your spam folder too.
May God Bless you!
I’d like to share my story with you in private Fr. Daniel, I am in desperate need of getting this off my chest as I feel I can’t share with anyone in person. Please email me, thank you and God bless.
I’ve sent you a private email. Please check your spam folder too. May God Bless you!