I’m Rosalie and my priest’s name is Jeremy. We met 10 years ago, although I already knew him as a child. He is an orthodox priest monk of very high level. I was extremely suffering from traumas and a hard life. Everybody had abandoned me. It was absolutely emergency situation! So I asked him to be with me as long as I do not have anybody else. He immediately agreed. I needed a person really involved with me, not just counselling!!!
It took only a few weeks when we fell deeply in love. I was so traumatized I was never sure if he really loves me but he said it all the time and was writing nice things on whatsapp and seemed to be in love with me. I struggled much because of my traumatic condition.
Well during this relationship development I also was on a journey towards God and Jesus (again). God himself “told” me this is my man. I completely began to understand the meeting of us both was inevitable! Of course I struggled him not being able to marry me, also because leaving church at his age is impossible. He is more than 30 years older than me.
I was convinced through God’s messages that this really is my man. God left no doubt. Absolutely no doubt. And we keep on maintaining this relationship for 10 years now. Sometimes he visits me, most of the time I visit him. He never agreed he would not love me no matter how much I argued with him. Also it is impossible to abandon him. God leads me always back to him. We are only hugging and kissing, does not mean we never wanted to get more close to each other. I do not want him to struggle with God so I am careful about getting closer with him than just kissing and hugging, although we kiss like a man and a woman for real.
Concerning priests and marriage: I think we should always seek solution to problems without leaving out God’s existence. God is logic. So I would start with logical thinking about that matter.
Only God knows our destiny. Many Christians believe there is always a soul for a woman or men to meet in this life. Although some might argue not everybody meets his or her soul to connect with, It does not change the fact that when deep love occurs between two souls and this love was given to these souls by God, nobody has the right to prevent this connection to stay alive in a holy and healthy way, for both of them. It is not healthy to be separated form the holy sacraments, when you live a love you can’t abandon!
A priest can be lead into service and out of service by God. If he falls in love with a woman and this love is true love it would be a sin to prevent them to live this love. Logically thinking a woman is not worse than a dog or pet. She has also a holy living soul with whom one can connect to without any sin. How can you just abandon and throw away a living holy soul even if the soul belongs to a woman? This is complete insane mindset!
Promise celibacy for the rest of your life is blind and not a failure of such men who do promise this. You can never know whether you meet a soul you want to connect with in a deep way or not. So the decision is made by God.
Sometimes the love by soul is followed the connection by flesh. Strong love can develop like this. There is nothing sinful about this. On the other side sin is committed by those who prevent such couples to live the full life in church with dignity. Many couples have to wait for years until the pope allows them to marry and to take part in the sacraments of the church. This is not a situation that should occur.
We can look at the example of Christian orthodox churches where priests are allowed to marry. They prove that they are responsible family fathers and afterwards they can become a priest. But here we see also the ignorance of God’s will to occur in our life. The wonder of love can also fall upon priest monks, who until the point of becoming priest monks have not met their woman to love yet.
Such situations force the secret couples to live in secret and is followed by very much struggle. No, it is not possible to think that you should and can always abandon such a relationship. To try with every part of your soul to forget your beloved is insane. Why should you abandon true love?
Often you can’t live without this person. It seems to be like this, you are absolutely connected by God and strong love. Strong love is a phenomenon that makes you ill if you can’t live it. You do not always have to be aware of your partner being sent to you by God. You just know you can never let go.
So in my opinion the church should generally accept that destiny of people is in God’s hands and the church can not reign over lives of people instead of God. If a catholic priest or an orthodox priest monk meet a woman they want to marry there should be a regular possibility to do so, without the struggles to occur that you maybe loose church and by the way God. These are severe wrong beliefs, such people are brainwashed by an ideology which is far from logic and God.
Readers! You’re kindly requested to continue the discussion with your useful and intelligent comments. May God Bless you All!
First I want to say I am sorry you had a hard life. It is nice when we have friends that can help us through struggles.
I am not sure I understand something you have said: You mentioned that you have asked that priest to ‘be with you’… What do you mean? In a relationship?
Hopefully you find the peace of heart you need and desire.
Yes,,original A,,i think she meant she needed her priest in a strong loving relationship to help her heal from a very traumatic past. I loved Rosalie’s story. She is so blessed by God to have such a nice loving man and priest in her life. It is too sad that they have to go around hiding their true love all because the roman catholic church is too stupid and ignorant to allow optional celibacy. The church has made its’ own laws and go around saying they are God’s laws. What big baloney!!!! I sure hope by the end of this year at the october synod..this stupid law of forced,,mandatory celibacy will finally end. Blessings to Rosalie and her priest. And blessings to you all on this great blog.
Welcome to the blog Rosalie & thank you so much for sharing your story.
You bring up a lot of beautiful points. Like you, I do feel that God puts people in our lives for a reason. He also “writes” our personal love stories. He is the “author,” not the Church. Sometimes the person we love is a spiritual mentor, priest, or monk. When I always think of God’s role with my priest, J, I think of how He brought me back to him after 10 years. Although we didn’t speak or see each other, J was always in my heart. I felt a strong pull that I can’t begin to describe & I know it was God pulling me back to him.
I personally think your story is beautiful and I agree with so many things you said.
When you said “to promise celibacy for the rest of your life is blind,” it got me thinking about something I’ve been wondering about for a while. Here in the States, when we are around 19 yrs old, in university, we must declare a major, what we will study for the rest of our university career. It often angers me to think our culture asks 18-20 year olds to decide at such a tender age what they want to do with the rest of their lives as a career!! What do you know about life or yourself at that age?! So, to ask a man at a tender age to declare he wants to be celibate is the same thing–ridiculous and unrealistic!! Someone here posted how their priest was 13 and entered seminary. How awful! 13?!?! I think of myself at that age and I cringe. You cannot ask men to declare they will be celibate forever at an age when they have never experienced love or know anything about sexuality or relationships. Crazy indeed.
God bless you Rosalie!! I pray for you and your priest ❤
-MA 111
Halo ma111
Thank you for your prayers! We need it always. Are you also involved actualy with him?
Hi loveasfire-
No, I’m not physically intimate with my priest, J. However, we’ve been close friends on & off for 16 yrs. and there are feelings on both ends. It seems, though, right now feelings are more intense for both of us.
If you want to see the details of my story, it was published here on the blog on 12/24/18 (I think) and was entitled something like “Deep Relationship With a Priest.”
I’m not sure how our story will end up, but I certainly can use prayers. As you know, there’s nothing easy about loving a priest!
Blessings,
MA111
Halo Ma111,
I would be happy to pray for you sure. Don’t give up!
Hi MA111
Thank you for sharing , when you say God brought you back to him after 10 years what happened ? It’s truly God when there is no contact and then something like that happens
I understand that “pull” you speak of , l believe when God brings soulmates together nothing can stand in the way , no distance or time will keep His will from being done .
Hi S-
My story was published on the blog on 12/24/18 and that will give you more of the details. But, in a nutshell, 10 years ago (well almost 11 now), I was getting very close emotionally and spiritually with my priest, J. One day, it seemed he was going to act on or reveal his feelings to me, so I did what I thought would protect us both–I ran and cut off contact with J for over a decade. Within those years, I also lapsed and stopped attending church altogether. Last year, I really wanted to return to church, but knew I needed to be in a church with a priest who would be encouraging, non judgmental, and supportive. I didn’t automatically think of J or even consider it as a possibility since last I heard, he was serving in a church almost an hour away from me. I actually didn’t explain this in my original story, but I was obviously praying endlessly for God to help me find the appropriate church and environment to start practicing my faith again.
The more I prayed, the more I started to have actual dreams of J. The dreams were always the same and continued nightly for almost 2 weeks. They only stopped when I finally looked up J and realized he was now at a local church not far from me! I knew then that I was literally being pulled to go there and God was guiding me to do so. May sound crazy to some, but I strongly (and still do) feel I was sent there for many reasons. I’ve been attending J’s church for almost a year now. It’s awkward at times, but I’ve grown so much spiritually and emotionally from this situation, I know for certain it was God’s will. I also realized that if I feel God’s guidance/will so strongly, despite His knowing I love a priest, there’s nothing impure or shameful about the love. It took me a while to get past the shame and guilt of loving a priest.
It would be great to hear how you personally felt the “pull” if you want to share. It’s comforting to know others out there feel the same way I do; just because it’s a priest, doesn’t mean they can’t be a soulmate in our lives.
Many blessings !
MA111
I’m currently trying to read all the comments in the thread about “soulmates” and the definition. I didn’t read them all, but does anyone think of the term not necessarily in a romantic context, but in other relationships as well?
I DO view J. as a soulmate, but not just because I have romantic love for him. I have a number of “soulmates” in my life (and some that are no longer in my life). To me, that term simply means someone who has greatly impacted your life, that you automatically gravitated to for one reason or another, and have a strong bond with and affinity for. A close connection that cannot be explained. Whether we want to admit it or not, there are people who we are immediately drawn to more than others, whether it’s initially a physical attraction that catches our attention or their vibrant personality.
We later become aware that had these folks not entered our lives, we would’ve been left with a major void and many lessons unlearned.
I would describe 3 people in my life like this, one of them being J. The others are: a family member and a close friend who I actually am no longer in contact with.
I feel God puts specific people in your life and path at certain times, for many reasons (even ones we may never know). We’ve all heard that quote: “for a reason, season, or a lifetime.” I don’t really want to get into debating the definitions of “fate” or “destiny,” (especially on a blog that is somewhat spiritually based) but how can we not believe God purposefully and carefully chooses those in our lives?! How many billions of people are there in this world, ones we will NEVER know or meet? Thinking of it on that level just shows how awesome God truly is. That being said, God also gives us free will. I think God presents us with different options/choices and it’s up to us to use our faith, trust, and love in Him to help us choose the right path. If that path happens to include a priest, why look at it any differently than we would anyone else in our lives?
I’m starting to see that by my viewing J only as a priest and simply not as a human being, I’m treating him way differently had I would if he was involved in a different vocation or calling. The awkwardness and anxiety when we’re around each other has decreased now that I’m seeing him for who he is–not what he is. After all, isn’t that all God wants us to do? –to love one another and treat each other as we wish to be treated?
Yes, we may have to have different boundaries with our priests than we would with others because of their vocation, but it doesn’t make our love for them any less real or valid.
I, do, personally believe in “signs (maybe there is a better term?) I believe if we’re quiet enough to sit in stillness, pray, and have faith, in His time God will indeed reveal what he is asking of us.
Somewhere in the thread, I saw comments about asking God to remove the feelings we have if we are not to “pursue” our priest, whether it be admitting feelings or our love or taking it to the next level. I personally asked this of God myself, but in a different way: “I know for one reason or another, you placed me in J’s life again. I ask that as you walk with me on this journey, that the Holy Spirit impart wisdom, and that you assist me in being still enough to discern what would be for the greatest good of both J and myself. I thank you for whatever lessons and wisdom I am gaining because of our friendship.”
I described feeling as if I was being “pulled ” to J’s church again. Obviously, I guessed that it was for my spiritual development and returning to practice my faith again. But even as I recognized these as the purpose, I still had a nagging intuition there was more to it. If I never went to J’s church & was in this situation, my relationship with Mary would’ve never strengthened either.
At one point this past year, I began doubting myself–maybe being back around J. WAS just for my spiritual development, nothing more. Around that time, coming home from church (coincidentally?!), I was in a serious car accident, one the police told me I was lucky to get out alive, nevermind without sustaining life altering injuries. Unbeknownst to me, friends had called J and he came walking into my hospital room unexpectedly, on his own time, and dressed like a layperson. I later learned this was because as soon as he overheard his secretary on the call with my friend, he jumped in the car and drove directly to the hospital. Although I was highly sedated and in pain, I appreciated his gesture more than he’ll ever know. He told me that the idea of having lost me scared him and made him appreciate me and life, in general, so much more. It really changed how I look at my life and strengthened my faith. It also spoke volumes as to how J truly felt about me. J hates hospitals & he could’ve just called me.
I remember thinking after the accident “aha! This is the other reason I’m here and why I keep thinking there’s more to my being around J.” I would not have been driving in the area I got hit otherwise except for church.
I reasoned that was it, I had it all figured out & that nagging feeling finally would go away.
Except the nagging feeling not only continued, it grew stronger. There are certain things I choose to keep private but it’s becoming clearer that yes, God has me in Js church for many other reasons than just spiritual development.
Hopefully, it doesn’t take something as traumatic to reveal the purpose of your priest’s presence in your life…but if you feel God has you put you in the company of your priest for a reason, listen to that intuition or little nagging voice. There IS a purpose and lessons to be learned. Or else why would he have been placed in your life in the first place?
Congrats if you read this the whole way through, lol, and sorry for being long-winded. May we continue to be kind and supportive of each other and demonstrate God’s love as we support and assist one another on our unique journeys!
MA 111
Just to clarified my priest, was 13 when he went to what was then known as Pre Seminary.– basically it was just high school run by the Catholic Church for boys would were thinking about pursuing a life as a priest or whose parents hoped they would. It was a boarding school, and they could go home on weekends and summer– but it was more high school than seminary
And they were definitely not asked to promise celibacy at 13– my point was because he went to that school, he didn’t really have to chance to learn anything except from the RCC point of view. Most of the boys in his class did not go into full Seminary which would be another 7 years , so in the RCC view, he had plenty of time to change his mind and not take Holy Orders, that was done in his mid 20’s.
However if you spent your whole life hearing how wonderful being a priest is and it is not what you have to give up but what you have to gain that matters–I think for some young men that is very alluring. It is a form of brainwashing, because it is not giving them the full honest picture-and it is only once they are priests that some of these men understand that.
The RCC grants annulments for marriages if the marriage was done under false pretenses– at the very least the RCC should allowed the same for priests who discover only after becoming a priest what they were told it was like is not the way it is– giving them a quick and easy way out instead of holding their faith and their place in the RCC hostage, keeping them in their vocations, not out of desire, but fear, guilt or shame.
Promise CAN-
Sorry, I misread what you said about being 13 and the seminary. Although, I still think that’s way too young to be in that type of environment. As you explained, it can be the beginning of the brainwashing & being around peers and mentors who all the more encourage the priesthood as a vocation. I would think that would make a young man all the more eager to become a priest.
Blessings
MA111
Wow, Rosalie, I am happy you pointed this out about soul mates, as I’ve been wondering about this for a long time. I first met my priest when he was in high school, and I was in college, by going to his obscure, off the beaten track small town with my roommate on weekends to stay with her Mom and Grandma. And then never saw him again until late 1990s, and somewhere along the line in the early part of this century, we connected and became friends. I was never in his parish but got to know him through another priest who was a good friend. And now he’s late 60s, I passed 70, and I was able to see that we both fell in love with each other as he went through a stressful situation and I listened, and then when he recognized the emotions of love (and the chemistry between us) and didn’t know how to deal with it, he went into the deep freeze, where he still dwells.
I have been praying for God to either bring about a reconciliation OR take this love from my heart, whatever is God’s will for me. So far, He is NOT taking the love from my heart, waking me up to pray for my priest, leaving me to constantly think about him with deep feelings of love even though I ask for my mind to be freed, and what you wrote about soul mates is now impacting me because it makes total sense for my situation. I’ll keep on hanging on and see what God eventually does about this whole situation.
Thank you!
Brokenheart
Halo Brokenheart
Im so sorry you are suffering! Did he abandon contact with you? I hope God releases you or he will reestablish contact with you!
Yes, he suddenly cut me off cold after we had grown close to each other and told me not to contact him. I periodically send him cards for special occasions. But no response.
@Brokenheart I am sorry to hear that you get no answers from him. How did you get close? Maybe he just was thinking about breaking some sort of commandments, they are very “innocent” in this matter, the priests. Especially olther priests. But the only thing that can help you is praying. I also had some signs during time of separation that I should act more like I decided to be with him for sure. You can show towards God that you have reached a decision that you would be okay to get close to him. Then maybe you would get a response. Just leaving it up to God either or is maybe not enough. Tell God you want to love him but if you won’t get close to him for sure ask God to release you from this pain.
Broken Heart~
Oh my gosh~ you met your priest as a college student and decades later re-connecting! I am speechless… what a happenstance! Very sweet and special, indeed!
As you know, I am not an advocate of priest-woman relationship while he is actively priesting. But on that note, I have always thought or intuited something very different about your relationship since it seemed so wholly vested by both you *and* him. But it was just my intuition.
Now you share your meeting long before his ordination! And miles and years between, yet the connection presented, and as Nikki would say, the energy of attraction and love collided. A new energy, a new energy taking form totally alien to him. It is remarkable, and I will hold on to my *intuition* that you two are destined.
I want to pass a thought on to you: As we all experience very pivotal losses at some point in life, I think it is important to reflect on how we handled those passages. The *grief cycle* of loss, pain, acclimating to life without someone, something. Especially among men and their unique way of coping to grief and loss~ who are under the microscope of male expectations. Women can cry, and we have friendships to nurture our sorrow~ sorrow that can be experienced just how we choose; not the case for men.
And, although he has shut you out, I really believe we need to give him the space to grieve. No matter if he deserved his termination or not (that I believe was overkill), it was a life-loss that altered every single moment of his life *and* very publicly. So overwhelming he could not share with you~ a lady whose love and respect he cherished~ as well as live up to society’s expectations for men in grief.
You made such a good choice with letting it go by God’s way… and, I believe even more than ever, that you two will re-connect.
I will keep praying for you and your priest.
Be Blessed~
~Marshmallow
Hello Marshmallow, he did share all his agony of losing his priesthood with me over a period of many months, and that’s how we began falling in love. He talked, I listened, gave him emotional support, prayed for him unceasing. Helped with all the needs of becoming suddenly separated from the parish and all its benefits. But when he realized we were moving toward a much deeper, more intense relationship, he totally panicked. He had never before in his life had a relationship with a girl or woman. He didn’t know how to handle it and was scared. So in his own mind, he had to cast me out of his life. However, I have since learned he didn’t block me from phone, email, as I sent him an email a few months ago about a mutual friend’s accident. He contacted friend but not me.
And so I leave it totally up to God, praying like the leper in the Gospel: “If you so wish, Lord, you will lead him to reconcile with me.” That’s all I can do, along with praying he turns back to Jesus and frees himself from his porn habit and somewhat dicey crowd of guys (fellow priests, not the best role models or spiritual leaders) he hangs around with.
Just keeping on keeping on praying for him, and me as well. Another hour in the Adoration Chapel after Mass today.
Brokenheart
Brokenheart
If you will so graciously allow me– may I offer you some help in refining your prayer to make it more effective
Try something along these lines
Dear Lord—If you are willing Lord I know you can heal my broken heart-
I believe you brought (name of priest) into my life for a reason. If this reason is completed I ask you to heal my broken heart by helping me accept my role in his life is done.
However, I am willing to continue to love him, and I would like to have the relationship back the way it was, or better if that is in your plan for us– you know (name the priest) heart, you know him and love him more than I could–if you see he loves me as much I believe he does, then please remove the obstacles in his life that prevent him from accepting this love.
I know you will not violate his free will to accept my love, but you can remove the man made obstacles that are stopping him from doing what you know he wants to do. Yet I know you cannot make him love me–so if he doesn’t love me – then remove the obstacles in my life that prevent me from accepting that truth.
I believe in your perfect plan for both of our lives, and I trust you to guide me toward yours for mine, and his for his. If this plan is for us to be together, then I ask for the patience to wait for your timing and your understanding on what I need to do as I wait. I thank you for this gift of forbearance, it reveals to me, your loving patience toward all of us, as we strive to understand more of You and Your deep love for us. In your mercy I ask all this. Amen
And if you like you can use that word for word, or adjust it more to your situation and relationship with God– because I don’t want to imply you are praying the wrong way- God knows our hearts, but we do have to remember we cannot ask God for anything that is not in His character– God will not violate anyone’s free will, yours or his. So sometimes it is just a matter of tweaking our words a bit, to make our prayer more in line with God’s character– Did that makes sense? I hope so, and again, it is not my intention to offend and if I over step, I sincerely apologize.
You are giving good advise. That is what I was thinking about.
Bless you, Broken Heart.
You sound as though you are in a good place. I loved the term, “dicey”~ I have known one of those.
~Blessed Sabbath To Everyone!
@A I Literaly asked to be with me because I have nobody. I was open to a relationship but I needed not counseling but personal involvment. In this extreme situation I was not much thinking about relationship or not. I was in hell. I just said what I said. He said then he wants to be with me. Whatever this does mean.
ok loveasfire. It’s clear now.
If there is only one thing my time on this blog can do I hope it would be that everyone understands just because God is love doesn’t mean all ideas about love are from God.
for example
Soul mates– this is an Egyptian-Greek pagan teaching. the idea was the” gods”- would punished someone by tearing their soul in half, and then the two halves would search for each other in order to reunite– only to be parted again in death, and the process would start again in the next life. In this construct, your soul mate could be anyone.
Later Plato — yes, good old Plato again. His theory was in the beginning there was no male or female– then the gods, split whole souls into male and female– so every male soul was to find it’s female half and vice versa. But again, this was more about essence, meaning a man could find his female half in another man and vice versa. Basically the premise behind the origins of soul mates, is you are only a half a soul until you find your other half.
This is not from God as reveal to us in Jesus– God creates whole souls– we don’t need to go out there finding another half to complete us– this was a pagan idea which eventually got romanticized as way to explain our attraction for certain people– but this isn’t from God as reveal to us in Jesus.
If there is one truth about God as reveal to us in Jesus and since Jesus is the Word of God made flesh, this includes how God is revealed in Scripture. This God is a God of free will. God does not force us to love anyone. Love to be real love- must be freely given and if you feel you have no choice but to love someone, because you think it is your destiny, or you have no choice, I would question if that idea is really from God as reveal to us in Jesus.
Now, before everyone starts jumping down my throat– I do believe it is possible for God to call us to love someone specifically with Him. However God works with our free will, he doesn’t violate it. Meaning God is not limited to time and space like we are, He already knew who you would choose before you were even born, so it is possible He created you in a way that you would recognize your choice– and this might feel like to us, in our present moment as something we didn’t have say in– but we did and we do.
Meaning God did not create one person, perfect just for me to love– and it was just my bad luck this person is a Catholic priest. No, my priest has a path and reason for being that is not related to me loving him. God created him for himself, not for me to have a man to love. I can love my priest with God but not for God, and how that love is expressed is up to me.
Our Lord Jesus is our best example of what love should look like in whatever relationship we have, whether it be family, friends, stranger or romantic relationships. Not only in how we treat others, but how others should treat us. Of course we will never be able to follow His perfect example in our fallen state, but we can seek it and strive for it.
St. Paul states love is only happy with the truth– so if you truly love God, keep searching for His truth — His truth will be His best for you.
God bless anyone reading this long post and again I apologize for any errors that might have made reading this more difficult than necessary.
It would be interesting to read line 20 of Genesis Chapter 2: So the man gave names to all the livestock, the birds in the sky and all the wild animals. But for Adam no suitable helper was found.
And so what that is saying Fr. Daniel, is that God then created Eve as the “soul mate” for Adam, correct?
Yes, correct!
I was wondering if someone would bring up Adam and Eve as proof God does create specific people for each other
I get where you are going with this. If we have free will and choose the people we love then why didn’t God create five or six different woman, let Adam hang out with them, and then have him pick the one he liked the best for his wife– Sorta of like a Biblical version of the American TV show the Bachelor — where one guy lives in a house with 20 woman and each week one gets booted out, and he proposes marriage to one at the end of the season.
But instead the story is God created Eve from Adam’s rib, so when Adam would see her he would recognize who she was, and know she was meant for him– bone of my bone– the perfect woman for him, to be his help mate– but did Scripture ever mention the word love–no where did it say they loved each– in fact the story proves they did not
If Adam loved Eve where was he –her one true love– when the serpent showed up– he wasn’t there to protect her– she was facing the greatest temptation of her life alone and in typical male fashion Adam was off doing his own thing– and when she ate the apple, did he care about her spiritual well being– no he was more curious about the apple– and did Eve love Adam when offering him the apple no— and when this was all found out did either one of them love the other to back each other up– No, Adam threw Eve under the bus, blaming her for his sin– and Eve blamed the serpent
This is not a love story– it would take too long to go into this in more depth— but even if you take the story of Adam and Eve literally, theirs was more an arranged marriage. They hadn’t fallen yet, so they wouldn’t thought of saying No to God– at this point I don’t think they knew what free will was– so they were married– but I could make the case their marriage, didn’t really start until they got kicked out of Eden– only then did they have a choice— either they handle this exile together, or they could go their separate ways– by choosing to stay together, that was the choice– not because they were “made for each” and love was in the air, and the birds were singing love songs– it was base on the understanding, I need you, you need me, and we are in this together– we can do as a team with respect and love, like God showed us in Garden or we can fight the whole time and be miserable
No, the story of Adam and Eve does not prove God creates certain people for us, it only proves God can bring people into our lives, but ultimately it is up to them, how that will play that out. Don’t get me wrong, I do believe we can love and be attracted to someone’s soul, as much as someone, loves or is attract to physical appearance— so if you want to call that soul mates, you can I guess, but I just wanted people to be aware, where the term really came from and what it really means— we live in a world that is in love with idea of love, but the substance of love was found not in the Garden of Eden, where everything was perfect, and God gave Adam the perfect mate for him, but in the mud and dirt of the exile– when Adam really did need a help mate and vice versa— and love was most fully known, not not in our Lord’s teachings or miracles, but in his brutal death on a cross. —I am pretty certain if God asked me to die on a cross for my priest, I would say no– I love the guy, but not that much– and knowing this keeps me humble in my love for my priest– reminding who loves him most, and that’s not me that is God– that is the real love story of my priest’s life or anyone of our loves– and my role to be a part of that, not replace God as the lead.
Promise Can,
Your response really made me think….i agree with all you stated. Mostly, thinking on if Adam and Eve loved one another they would not have lead one another into exile. Love is more than a feeling, it is doing what is best for the one you love. Even if it’s not what you want. I have been thinking about this the last several weeks, so it was perfect timing to have read your post this day. Reflecting on the relationship I had with a priest years ago. I thought he loved me. But once I distanced myself from him, and look back on what occurred between us. It was not love. It was manipulation, lies, deceit, jealousy. He would become angered when I said or did something not in line with his thinking. In the beginning, I thought the attraction and chemistry I felt was love and meant to be. It wasn’t. A person who loves you doesn’t put their wants above your well-being. I thought the fact that we jumped right into a physical relationship meant he was different. I later found out it was because I wasn’t the first, wasn’t special. I really hate that I was so stupid. So easily manipulated.
I know what true love and sacrifice is, now.
I think about 1 Corinthians 13:4-8. Love is patient, is kind, not envious, not self-seeking. Full of hope. A beautiful passage of what love is.
Thank you for your words, I very much needed to hear them.
*no one
No One From No Where
I am so happy you finally understand what real love is– and please stop hating yourself for being stupid as you put it. You were NOT stupid– you gave your trust to someone before you really knew therm– but there’s not a person on the planet that hasn’t done that at some time in their life. You made a mistake, and you learned from it– this is life
I was so fortunate my priest was a man of integrity, never taking advantage of my affection for him for his own needs and pleasure. But had he not been I would probably made the same choices you did– but this is can happened with men who are not priests too–we just assume priest wouldn’t do it, which is why it is a shock when they do– which is why, it is up to us women to guard our hearts– I know this is not popular in this day and age, but maybe our grandmothers, had the right idea– get to know a man first, before sleeping with him– and if he is willing to dump you after two dates because you won’t put out– then he certainly doesn’t have the patience to love you for a life time–good to know before investing your heart or body. I wish I did that more in my 20’s, but again, we make mistakes, we learn from then–life
And I would like for you to consider changing your name to Some One From Some Where–you have great value, do not sell yourself short–
Halo Promise CAN,
thank you for posting. I do not know if you refer to my belief and my posting as something influenced by a teaching. My belief in this love is my pure experience with God and has nothing to do with a teaching or souls devided in two. Sure one can find his experience in several teachings or have something in common with several teachings, does not mean he or she is teached by this teachings.
I also do not know if you pointed at me saying that God does not force you to love or does not violate. If you refer to me or not. If this would be like this you could logically let go. But that is not always true. So why call it violating when love is something you want. Just call it “God knows better for you”.
There are many prayers that pray to find “the one and only”. These are christian prayers, not something from a foreign teaching. It is a common belief that God has the one and only for you even if you meet other men too during your journey here on earth.
When people call somebody soulamate it does not mean they spread a teaching. It is just their pure experience. I don’t care if these words are also used by any teaching and I don’t care if my true experience has something in common with whatever teaching.
My dear sweet lady– and to anyone else who wishes to read another very long post from me
I was not speaking about your situation directly but just in general because many of the woman on this blog were speaking in terms of love and destiny– as if loving someone was not a choice. If you are choosing to love your priest, God is not violating your free will, but working with it.
Please understand my concern is only when people use words and terms to describe something when they don’t understand where the term came from– I was not saying what you are experiencing is not profound or even from God, I just worry when the term soul mate is used– I gave my insight on the origins of word and what it really means but what anyone does with the knowledge is up to them.
I know you are new to the blog, so I don’t know if you know my whole story– I have been in love with my priest for over 17 years. It began in a similar way as yours– although I did not have as hard as time as you, I too felt I needed someone to walk this journey of life with– someone to witness the fact that I lived, someone to see the real me. I had some superficial friendships, family who cared, but didn’t really see me for me, just the person they thought I was. So I prayed for God to send me this person, to search the hearts of all the men out there and find the man who He knew could love me in this way, to fill this emptiness in my heart, that even God hadn’t filled.
During this time I became attract to the new priest who came to help in my parish– and like many on this blog, I was so strongly attracted I could not understand it. It was very much like all the romance songs out there– I felt he was “the one” yet, I had to wonder how could he be “the one” if he was a priest. Would God be so cruel as to have chosen for me a man, who could not be available for marriage? So trust me I struggle with this idea that this was from God– I sought signs as well, got many to prove to me that this was God’s will. I kept track of all the signs, so when the day would come, that all these promises of God would come true, I could look back and know how faithful God was. This is why I use the name Promise on this website, because so much of my love, for this priest started and stayed for so long solely based on what I thought God had promised-
Before he was transferred I told him of my love for him, my willingness to have any kind of relationship with him, except sexual– I told him how God was behind it all– and his response was so hurtful and so painful, that it was like a knife was plunged into my heart. But as I prayed, I kept getting “signs” that told keep going, he is yours, all the kind of stuff you speak about—So I kept writing to him, unlike other priests in some stories here, my priest never told me to stop contacting him– which I would have done if he every said those words– for me his silence was consent. I did this for 3 years without a response from him, and during this time, I prayed A LOT–I became aware that many of my childhood issues coming up as I struggle to keep loving someone who was so awful to me– Slowly I was realizing my love wasn’t based on who my priest was as a human being, but based on what I thought his love was going to do for me—and the more I prayed, the more I realized– signs are dangerous things, because when we allow signs to make our choices for us, we are giving up our free will, which is never a good thing.
So I was so confused I got to the point liked Brokenheart, I didn ‘t know what to do, so I decided to ditch my responsibility for my own choices and leave it to God– either to return the relationship or to remove the love from my heart. Then shortly after that prayer, my priest was going to be in town for a parish function, that I was going to — I hadn’t seen him in three years, and he treated me very professionally– when I hugged him, it was like hugging a stone wall–I had mentioned in a letter before I saw him that I was thinking of leaving the Catholic Church– I thought surely if he loved me, the priest in him would respond to that, by urging me to stay– this is how desperate I became to get a crumb of attention from him– So at this event he asked if I had email– I did not at the time, so he said he would write to me. I thought God made the choice, and this meant the relationship was coming back to me.
Every day for three weeks, I went to my mailbox with such hope, only to have that hope dashed. It killed something in my soul a little each day, and by the end of the three weeks I hated this man, more than I hated anyone in my life. It was a vile hate–and every ounce of this so call destiny love, so meant to be, all my attraction, all the passion, all the dramatic two ships in the night, all the star crossed lover ideas about love– all the I am doing just what God wanted me to do, all of this died — with a big complete thud not a shred of affection left- nothing– I was done with him and I was done with God– because if this was from God, then God was a mean son of a bitch– excuse my language, but that is what I felt.
So please know whenever I say anything on the blog I never say it lightly or from a place of not understanding– I been at every stage, everyone of you has been–yes we all different, but there is a sameness to our stories that speaks to be more than coincidence.
This is when I began to stop looking for signs, and began seeking God’s truth. And this is when God’s true voice gave me a choice– do I want to love “Peter” I will call him Peter or do I want to go on believing that if Peter would just love me back, all my problems would be solve– all my issues would somehow be less painful if he love me back in the way I wanted him to love me back– was I looking to Peter’s love to heal only what God could heal in my heart.
This will become too long of a story, but from that point on, I asked God to share His love for Peter with me, that I was willing to love Peter for who God knew him to be– not who I hope he would be. And I knew loving Peter with God, was my reward, meaning the joy of loving Peter would not be how Peter would love me back, but how sharing God’s love for him through me, would produce fruit that will last into eternity.
So God did not remove the love I had, but He did want to perfect it — grow it from this very immature, very self absorbed idea of love, and turned it into the love He has for all of us.— after that point — it wasn’t about Peter and what he did or didn’t do- but loving Him with God– so the freeze out after this point was another 6 years. One letter per month, sharing my faith journey with him–some personal stuff, and news– and never getting a response. Focusing on sharing whatever God placed on my heart, trusting whatever I was sharing was exactly what Peter needed to hear for God to work His perfect plan out for Peter.
Then Peter got transferred again– and I thought that was it– I wasn’t going go try to track him down, and I knew Peter would never write me to let him know where he was– then lo and behold, I was able to get internet– so I switch to emails– those went unanswered– and I began doing searches on line– came across websites like this one, filled with painful stories of women in love with a priest– and based on those stories I thought God wanted me to do the noble thing and let go. So I told Peter I was ending it, and I was never going to contact him again.
A couple months later I got ill and was in the hospital– and in my fear I made the choice to reach out to Peter, just to have prayer. I don’t know if it was my saying goodbye or my illness or what but he was different,– he began emailing back — and we have been exchanging emails ever since– we only speak about our faith– but when we speak of love for each other it is all very Christian in tone– but I am okay with it– I don’t see Peter as my soul mate, I realize Jesus was– yes on lonely days, I still play the what if game, but that is normal– and I know even if Peter were free to marry, I would not marry him — how could I want to marry a man I hadn’t even spend one full day with in my life? I would have to get to know him more as a person, to want to spend every day with him.
So trust me please all you wonderful dear woman out there– I understand more you know– I get that destiny thing– I do believe this all happened for a reason– but I do know the role I played and how God worked with my choices—not dictated them– free will is vital– love is not a powerful force you get sweep up in—attraction yes, passion yes– and these things were created by God– but they are parts of puzzle– not the whole picture.— like Marshmallow said if you don’t get all the pieces-a romance is not fully bloomed–If it is romance/ marriage you want– which is why I stress knowing what you want– but if you what to love him for him, that might mean no romance or marriage
So this is why I get nervous when I hear words like signs, soul mates, destiny, was meant to be, true love– In my life journey, where I am now, I know how those ideas of love truly make small what love truly is–it foreshadows something just as pleasurable, but not inward, less about me and Peter– but more about the how this love touches all the lives Peter life touches, and all the lives I touch including all you and everyone on this blog–if that is destiny, okay, I don’t use that term— all I know, God answered my original prayer, just not in the way I was expecting it–
Like I said before I would love for all you not to have to go through what I did, but I know how God worked so much healing in life, and how much closer I am to God, how much more I understand His heart–I wouldn’t change anything if I could– my only suggestion is if you really feel God is calling you to love a priest, who is staying a priest– and you are certain you are not after marriage or romance– then perhaps the stumbling block is God is just waiting for you to be willing to let go of all the worldly notions of love, in order to be fully open to understand love the way He means for all of us to know it. When you find this love, your heart will be at peace.
Again sorry for the super- long post, and for any errors.
Thank you for sharing. Yes you are right it is something going on to develop us. But I can’t prevent me also to mention that this were not only small signs I experienced. There was a lot more and more evident what I know about it now. I just can’t public this here openly because nobody would believe it anyway and people would only think we would be somehow outside of church. I literaly am not able to leave bed when we break up contact. There was this dream also, if I am allowed to mention this. God put me in a very spiritual dream. As if an angel or God was enlightening my head and touching my head. During this dream in wich I fall completely helpless and suddenly, there came an email from him to my inbox. I clicked on this email and woke up. I thought this must be only a dream. But in the same minute there was his email in my inbox for real. I opened it. It was his response to me arguing with him to admit me that he does not love me or I will take measures. I just wanted to let go. I could not bear it anymore. But in this email he wrote: I will never say this Mrs. Commander because that is not true!
So I gave up resisting. I geht completely phsysically and psychically not able to move, to think, to speak to anybody when I try to abandon him. I do not know if this should be called forcing me through God. This was only a small example. There are much more things going on.
Love As Fire~
I am sorry life put you so vulnerable, and my hope is your priest/monk is appropriate with you. Clergy~ like licensed counselors, psychologists and psychiatrists~ have an imbalance by virtue of their profession. Boundaries are a legal piece to their relationships.
In the USA, clergy, mental health professionals and other counselors, attorneys and physicians can be held in criminal contempt for crossing the line of ethical conduct by personal relationships~ even if they are consensual~ with or without sex.
Please tread carefully. Might I suggest contacting your physician who can direct you to the proper professional who will not have a piece of your heart? Many of these agencies do sliding scale pay for services.
Know you have a safe place here, and we are all here to help each other. Even if the words are not always what we want to hear.
Take Care, Love As Fire!
Special Prayers For You~
~Marshmallow
*laugh* a physician? How could a physician help me with that? I do not need a physician to help me with strong love. For those who never experienced such a strong bond maybe it seems like an illness. If this would be illness no physician coul help there anyway. Struggles of love are because of strong love, no physician could ever help with it, even deal with it or understand this. This is an unbreakable bond. Not something calles superficial love with “feelings” and than just exchange the person with another! Or just forget about this. No.
Eve was made from and brought to Adam by God’s design….so , yes God can absolutely bring ppl together, no matter what it’s labeled, soul mate , bashert(e),destiny, and so on.
This was God’s perfect plan , but we exist in an imperfect world, so sometimes 2 ppl who are “meant to be together “, may not end up together.
Or maybe they were brought into our lives to help us to fulfill another destiny, still can be a soul connection from God and born of love, just not together.
Matthew 19:6 is relevant as well to me, believing that God brings two together, nothing should be able to separate them , and if anything can , including misguided loyalty to the Rcc , not God himself , imo,then that’s God’s will too.
Resisting God’s will never brings peace or real happiness.
Cherish the love and let it bring us to our true destiny, made possible by God bringing us this great love in the first place.
It’s still love.
Beautiful and true Nikki
Nikki, thank you! I understand “soul mate” and the way God works to bring people together the same as you explained. My meeting this priest again after a few decades from our teenage years, and becoming his friend, and then love happened, to both of us, was NOT coincidence at all, but I see it as a God-incidence. There is no way on earth I would have naturally met him when he was 15 without God setting up the circumstances, me coming from another part of the USA to a southern state for college, acquiring a roommate I didn’t even know, and she was from his small obscure town and kept taking me home with her on weekends. So I met him and he wasn’t even Catholic, and then decades later, I came back south after 30 years in the north, and here he is a priest, and not in the diocese where he was from, and we reconnected. We also discovered we have a lot in common, including our college majors. That’s why I’m inclined to believe we are soul mates who finally found each other. Now if he would only come out of the deep freeze, OR the alternative if he won’t, that God will free me from this deep love for him. All I can see, looking back, is that God arranged the entire thing.
We do need to set boundaries though.
People who are truly meant to be together will be , howvever there are limits to time and waiting, wishing as well.
I don’t believe God would want us waiting a lifetime, his gift of life is too precious.
It’s like an affair, professionals agree if a man/woman doesn’t leave their spouse within 6 months or so, the chances of them leaving are very slim.
Time to move on , where we’re meant to be.
Brokenheart–
I love your story so much. I can tell you love your priest so much and vice versa. I know he’s being stubborn right now, lol, but I’ll get to that in a second. What’s even more beautiful, is your story began (much like mine) many years before and it was a pure & innocent love. I mean that to say you were both so very young when you met and established feelings & a friendship. The fact that you were reunited years later is not a coincidence (btw, I don’t believe in coincidences lol; there’s no such thing!) God clearly played a role in your story and it’s refreshing to see because it’s so obvious! I hope that makes sense.
I do believe in soulmates (or whatever term you wish to use)…I just wrote a really long comment here about that. I also mentioned in that comment how incredibly difficult is for me to believe God doesn’t put these priests in our lives or paths. I feel J is a soulmate; I knew it the instant I laid eyes on him. I’ve only had that connection where you lock eyes and “just know” happen one other time besides J. Looking back at both of those relationships, I not only learned major life changing lessons, but also experienced the most growth from both; the irony is not lost on me.
Back to your priest and his “deep freeze” (btw, I’ve never heard a word that so perfectly describes how these priests
can behave! I know it certainly can describe J too at times!) …have you ever considered this as his way of protecting you because he does care deeply for you? This notion may get a lot of criticism but sorry, it’s how I feel. I’ve done this personally myself so I feel I can speak on it. In my story, I left J a decade ago and went silent on him; I simply broke off all contact without his knowing why. I didn’t do that because I didn’t care for him but quite the contrary–I did it because I cared for him so deeply. It was intended as protection, not rejection (which he thinks it was). What I failed to realize until recently was he never asked for that protection; who knows if he even wanted It?
As you know, J has exhibited similar confusing behavior and I spoke with a close male friend (the same one who coined “Father Arrested Development ” lol) about it. He felt J’s “up and down” behavior (or push ‘n pull; when I come towards him, he pulls away and vice versa) that makes me feel as if I’m on an emotional rollercoaster is actually a demonstration of his feelings, that he actually does care. It’s obviously not how a mature and insightful man would act, but that doesn’t make the behavior any less “meaningful” (for lack of a better word).
I have worked in the psychology field for over 20 yrs. now and remember one of the first things they taught us in school: “people think the opposite of love is hate. It is not–it’s apathy.” The reason for this is when you truly could care less for or about someone, you don’t react one way or another. If you’re getting a reaction, albeit a negative one, it’s a reaction nevertheless. If the man felt nothing for you, he would not make a point of cutting off contact. He’d simply be indifferent. Someone that has made a point of cutting off contact the way you have described is by no means indifferent as far as I am concerned. Please understand, I’m in no way condoning his behavior (believe me, I know how infuriating it can be!) but just trying to look at it from a different angle, one that has helped me.
I pray for you and that you’ll find peace in your heart. I can’t imagine how this feels for you and you certainly don’t deserve it!
Blessings,
MA111
The use of love seems over-kill throughout the life of this blog. Love is not just a feeling. Or a need. It is a destiny typically ignited by chemistry; a chemistry that grows and commits to a destiny requiring unbridled commitment on the part of both persons involved.
And, love requires certain ingredients far beyond the warm, fuzziness of what is being called love. Two persons attracted to one another really do not experience love until they have grown their attraction having journeyed through all the transitions that come one’s way living life. Part-time, minimized contact with an avowed man cannot build a solid foundation and grow those feelings of attraction no matter how *good* those fleeting times feel to us. The courting dance of lust and passion (a fun and intoxicating time) needed that typically has a six month life span across the world of relationships~ a passage that grows toward commitment or the end.
“Loving” or even attraction to a priest is one big hassle~ an exorbitant amount of energy all expended by the woman ; he lays the turf, you walk on it or leave. A *love*~ that is not even exposed to the normal grinds in life that can challenge the best of relationships. So then, how can one trust him to be there for us during the grinds? You just can’t.
If you want a *boy toy*, a priest is perfect! (I don’t believe in objectifying persons, but that is typically what a priest does to the woman he is attracted.)
~Marshmallow
Amen!
I’m saddened that was your experience.
Love in its essence is energy, it cannot be created or destroyed.
Everything in life boils down to choosing love or fear.
I will always wholeheartedly choose love, no regrets, maybe some detours, but well worth the ride.
Very nice Nikki
Love is energy. We are energy. Soul is energy.
We have a interconnected web of energy with one another, our loved ones, and God.
I choose love over fear as well.
Peace be with you.
Nikki~
Oh, no! I have had wonderful, love and *loving experiences* throughout my life. The priest was the let-down; he ate my heart and spit it all over the parish. But, I dodged a bullet, and life is *finally* moving forward with recouped joy and optimism.
And, at nearly 66, my heart still believes in the goodness of love, relationship, companionship and physical love and affection!
I love your metaphor of love as energy~ but love as an energy (like all energy) takes on different forms. The trick is to connect the two sets of energy that bring mutual satisfaction with respect and dignity.
Maybe it is simply fate?
Blessings To You~
~Marshmallow
Yes Nikki and B. I chose love over fear too. I am so glad I did. If I had chosen fear, I would have missed out on my true love and soulmate.
Hi Nikki~
I like the metaphor of love as energy~ energy, that like all energy, changes form.
But, I think it is quite minimalist to think “everything in life boils down to love or fear.” I am not sure if I am understanding you correctly, but in my journey, there have been times where there were far more options than just love or fear.
Christian love (agape), of course, is our universal call. Other forms of love not quite so distinct or left as one of two options. And certainly in romantic love there can be other variables to prevent love-mates. That doesn’t mean we have fear. Sometimes it’s all about love or practicality.
In my encounter with a priest, I backed away from the option of a *secret love affair*. Fear, nope. Aside from my personal repugnance to be a secret in the life of a man avowed to something else, I first and foremost had my three kids, their spouses and my eight grand-children to consider. How would I reconcile a relationship with a priest and yet encourage my grand kids to make ethical decisions when it costs personal sacrifice and discomfort?
Coupled with that, a secret affair never stays secret, and with almost 100% assurance, I would have lost my job~ a profession well-steeped serving all faiths; a highly visible position in my city of 100,000 working for a five-generation family business. A profession dominated by men. That is not fear talking, but the very *practical* side of losing my retirement plan paid in for 35 years at age 60, health insurance and compensation that few professions provide, and I do not mean money. Plus, having a tarnished reputation.
Perhaps some will view those reasons as fear, there is an element to be extracted I suppose, but for me it was all about making a difficult decision that was aligned to my personal ethics *and* my personal economy.
Maybe I did not capture your intention, but this is what I have distilled. Love to hear your feedback.
Blessings, Peace~
~Marshmallow
Nikki,
I love your description of love. I also can relate to the love versus fear. You are correct–love is definitely worth the ride. Beautifully put.
Yes Marshmallow, choosing love over fear is minimalist, that’s the beauty of it all.
I’m not referring to choosing to love someone or rejecting it , but rather acting and perhaps more importantly reacting from a place of love.
Resentment, bitterness, guilt, doubt and so on and on are all derivatives of fear.
If we make the decision to just keep the feelings of love we had and let the rest go, there is no room for the fore mentioned fears.
If we can’t cherish the love or at least the lessons learned to release ourselves for something greater , I would seriously doubt if there was any love in the first place. That in itself should be easy to walk away from.
I’m not a big believer in text book labels for love.
Love can be an embrace between lovers, or letting your child have a donut before dinner just because their smile melts your heart…it’s all love and it always feels right.
So choosing love over fear is exactly that , a decision to act and react out of love, and it begins with self love , which at times may mean releasing ourselves from a love affair.
I have written before that this by no means diminishes the love that was shared , and certainly can’t erase it.
Blessings
Adam thew Eve under a bus. Hilarious Promise Can.😀
Yep, I had a good laugh, too!
Thanks, Promise Can!
And, we are so lucky to have lived in the birthing era of *Love & Peace*~ great days they were!
~Marshmallow
I sometimes wonder if we would really like our priests if we REALLY got to know them or spent more time with them. And see the “real” them.
So true. Most of us really know just a snippet of them~ and even then, it’s with a collar, vestment and a plethora of congregants and the public.
I got to know my priest as he really is over many months and he was in polo shirts and jeans. We spent an incredible amount of time together just talking, taking care of each other. No sex, but some kisses and heavy duty hugs. He was kind and loving, though mostly concerned with his own issues. I do believe I got to see the “real” him. He has a good heart but is a very confused adolescent male in his late 60s.
I just wanted to be clear I spoke out of love for everyone — we are all on a journey in life, and we all have different experiences, so our levels of understanding of life, love, God are all shape by that.
If anyone of us believes they have all the answers for themselves let alone for everyone else, they would be wrong– including me if we could grasp everything about God He wouldn’t be much of a God would He?
The reason I have a problem with the term soul mate, are the reasons I laid out earlier, so I will not go into them again.
God gave you all free will, which includes the free will be believe whatever you want for what ever reason you need to to believe it– but know truth and what we believe to be true are not always the same thing. I can believe I can fly all I want, tell myself it is true, but chances are when I jump off a cliff, I will fall –this is reality, so just be careful– I know God works it all for good.
Yet if soul mates are a God thing, then my life experience has shown me, my soul mate is our Lord Jesus Christ. His heart was made for mine, and mine heart was made for His—for him I would die on a cross, or any other way. I know my soul was made whole when He entered my heart– for me my priest is not my soul mate, but by loving him I love my true soul mate Jesus. This is why I did not stop loving my priest when all common sense told me to stop, because loving my priest with Jesus, expressing our Lord’s love to him, so my priest can experience God’s love for him through me, not because of me– sustains me–
And likewise on this blog, when I write anything that helps anyone, my joy is not because I could help you, it is knowing my beloved Jesus is reflecting His love for each you, with my most inadequate words. And as I said, just because i don’t think the word you should be using is soul mate, because what you are describing isn’t what soul mates are in reality– doesn’t mean I think you don’t love your priests deeply or that God isn’t involved. My only goal was to make clear love-we are not pawns that God moves around on a chess board– we co operate with God’s will, we are not puppets to it.
Again my inadequate words are speaking profound truths about God so badly that I apologize for even trying.
Promise CAN~
Thank you so much for sharing your heart and soul here~ please don’t apologize for the length of your messages… Your words are filled with abounding inspiration, and I am grateful for your letters to us… Letters, I say, because your writing is though it is addressed to each of us individually. A special gift!
You spend enormous time, thought and prayer in these, your tomes. They have been very influential in my healing~ a voice of the divine. And, I thank you.
Although each writer brings a spirit to share, the Lord has made you a vessel of exceptional understanding, compassion and a messenger of love and peace~ and He sent you to us as we journey through the many passages of these unique encounters with Catholic clergy.
Thank you, Promise~ God Bless You!
~Marshmallow
Part of my story is pain. There were times when he acted like these cold-hot actions towards me. There were times when I had little signs that he would love me, I mean no signs at all. There were times when he wrote me not to be angry with him and that he wants to fly away with me, only with me, to be only with me and move far away. It was very contradictional behaviour. Cold-hot.
There was a time when I felt like he would abuse me deliberately. I could not help me but pray. Then there is always this matter: Does he not have enough time or does he not have the will to support me? For example emotionaly. When I want to hear nice words from him, there is this silence. I broke up with him very often because of his silence and ignorance. And still I feel deeply connected, not only emotionaly. There are so many ways in wich I love him. And when we have beautiful time I am helpless, my soul opens towards him and I can’t do nothing about this.
I wonder why his love towards me does not have the power to overcome the circumstances. My love at the beginnig was able to do so, I am sure.
That is why I am looking for women who maintain such a relationship. So we can support each other with this pain and struggle.
Hi loveasfire,
I am very fortunate as I am one of a very few on this forum who have had a reciprocal, loving, respectful relationship with a priest that lasted over several years. Mine was a very mature and intelligent but passionate priest, who reluctantly, but finally, gave his heart and soul to me. I have no doubt in my mind that had he not passed away, we would still be happily “together”. One of the reasons for this is because I loved him so much that I always wanted what was best for both of us. That meant never giving him an ultimatum to leave the priesthood, or to demand more of him that he could give. I just so happy and grateful for what we had, and so was he, that we didn’t care about anything else, as long as we loved each other and could spend some time together.
In regards to the hot/cold behaviour, I have shared in previous comments on previous posts that both my priest and I were guilty of this at the beginning of our relationship, before we knew where we stood in the relationship. What helped us was that it was not done in a malicious manner and we both later understood why it happened.
Like any priest/parishioner relationship we had to be cautious that no one found out about our feelings for each other. This was especially critical in our situation because of my abusive (ex)husband. For me, I would find that my feelings for my priest were too intense and I would become a bit out of control and find myself getting somewhat careless. Then I would step back to try to regain some control over my feelings (cold behaviour). Later I was again overwhelmed by my feelings and missed him so much that I would go overboard in giving him attention (hot behaviour). He told me it was the same for him, but worse because he had not experienced these feelings for a woman before.
So for us, although the hot/cold behaviour was annoying and it definitely hurt, we later looked at it as part of the growth of our relationship. We were able to talk about it, forgive each other, and put it behind us knowing that there are better ways to handle those concerns than with hot/cold behaviour. Later we also got very good at communicating to each other when we needed to slow down and take some time to ourselves, or to just be alone with God. And the hot/cold behaviour stopped when we began being more open and honest with each other.
I know that hot/cold behaviour is hurtful, but you have to ask yourself if it is a deal breaker and look very carefully at what else is going on in the relationship. I have found that this is a very common behaviour for priests and I believe for many of them it is not done to hurt the woman, but because the priest is trying to cope and deal with his feelings. And sometimes they mistakenly think it will hurt the woman less if they push them away than if they allow the woman to love them and try to maintain a relationship.
Those are just my observations and experience. I hope this helps.
Thanks for sharing your story. You are in my prayers.
Halo Cat,
I am very happy you commented my story! You are absolutely right, we need to learn to accept and talk to each other. I am very touched by your experience!!! This is what I am dealing with. There are this times, during weeks and months, when I experience his uncondicional love towards me. It is so overwhelming I can’t resist! My soul is catched anew an anew each time. No matter how much he had hurt me earlier, we are strongly connected.
I wish he would try to talk to me in good times. But he only feels the need to talk about us when I am suffering and already in the process of leaving him. But I am not able to do this anymore. It costs to much struggle so I am accepting my love for him and praying God won’t let me suffer like this anymore. I have to accept I love him and learn to deal with the times he does not want to receive my love. This is very very hard.
The emails he writes me, the calls he gives me when he feels I am abandoning him is overwhelming. It is so wise and so open and so sure to be with me. But in “friendly” times he feels like being an idiot not able to say any wise word, not able to feel the need to talk about us. He tries to pretend there is no need to talk deeply. We could keep it superficial.
I wonder about this coldness arising somewhere somehow during some time periods. He than even is able to say rationally that he never experienced such a love fire like with me. But I am not able to believe this during me FEELING his coldness.
Than he somehow tried to push me away in former times. That is trowing me always back when he resists me, in the hard times. I do not know if these hard times are already in the past and only continue living in my soul. Or if the hard times can occur for real again. Because he shows so little of him self during some times that I feel throwed back to the past.
I get more and more signs during everyday life that he thinks of me. But still can’t stop me being afraid the hard times could return. We are only able to talk deeply when he feels the need to do so. If I have this need he tries to avoid talking. I am not making much pressure because of that because he already felt so much pressure during the first years when I was suffering so much, it took all his energy and he still did not find the key to help me.
He somehow does not understand why I begin to doubt if he loves me all the time. Because of our hard past an when he moves towards acting like this again. Love is reciprocal in the way that if you do not get what you really(!) need it makes you doubting and that hurts like hell. Living in doubts is painful. A beloved one should not leave the other living in doubts even if it seems there is no reason to doubt. A beloved one should care about the real feelings of his partner and react somehow to this.
But my monk is a more rationally lead person. He needs arguments to give me what I need. He somehow was a long time on the way to try to forget me because he wantet to be a christian free from sin. I was horrified by the idea he does not recogninze our love as holy and something you can accept without feeling like a sinner. He still was in this trap fighting against us to be a correct monk. But he never admitted it deeply. He jus sometimes said that he tries not to meet me because his confessor priest said so to him.
These were hard times believe me. I am trying to convince him to pray for us, our love, our relationship. To bring “us” to God! But he thinks our relationship has nothing to do with God and that he should not pray like this. While I know better. He is trapped in the trap God ignores “us”. The ide of “us” is also seen by God. You can’t hide it from God so I try to explain him that things can become better if he prays for “us”, our relationship. But he is afraid to bring “us” to God in prayer. He is so trappe in this brainwashed celibacy ideology, still. Although he admitted that he can’t live without me recently. It was a shock for me. For 10 years he never said he could not live without me. Than suddenly he wrote me to confront me with my behaviour: He said: LoveasFire, you KNOW I can’t live with you please be not angry with me, this hurts so much. I was perplex, shocked. How coul I know? He NEVER said this earlier. And he added “you know that”, how could I know?????
Most of the time he hides. So how could I have known? He just thinks I would know! He is not looking at his own behaviour. He is blind to what I know and what I do not know.
Halo Cat,
I just can’t leave it. Your story that your beloved has passed. There exists this intresting video on youtube. Miracle of damascus part 10, from minute 3.45 and part 11 and 12. It is an actual christian wonder that is going on over the whole world. It gives in dark minutes the possibility to strenghten one’s belief that this earthlife is not forever. That one will see his beloved again.
I believe you are the *only* woman on this forum that has had a “reciprocal, loving and respectful relationship” with a priest. At least in the few years I have been visiting.
~Marshmallow
Not so Marsh Mallow
There is another.
Hello Loveasfire,
Thanks so much for the interesting video. I have so much I want to say to you but unfortunately I have been a bit overwhelmed. I had to go back to Canada to deal with some more legal issues and have been back and forth a few times in recent weeks.
One thing I want to assure you is that there are a few other woman on here who have good reciprocal relationships, for example MM, Angelfish and Heaven Leigh to name just a few. Hopefully they will connect with you too.
Thanks for your comments and hang in there. If he’s starting to tell you how he feels, that’s a good thing.
I’ll comment more when I have more time but I just wanted you to know that I read your comments and am praying for you.❤
Halo Cat,
I too was praying for you today. Thank you very much for your prayers. No need for fast answers. I am just happy to have heared about you!
That would be the utmost…when readers pray for the good of each other! Thanks..you made my day!
Yes Father Daniel, knowing someone is praying for me makes my day as well.
Prayers are extremely important…and prayers for those who hurt you can do wonders for all involved.
Hi Loveasfire,
I am so happy to hear that your priest is beginning to express his feelings to you.
My priest’s confessor told him to cut off contact with me as well, but my priest was only able to follow this advice for a short time before he came back to me with his heart bursting with love and aching from guilt. He tried so hard to do the right thing and remain free from sin.
I don’t think that when your priest is worried about your relationship being a sin, he thinks it is unholy. I often thought about Matthew 5:28 – But I say to you that every one who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. I suppose it depends what your interpretation of “lustfully” is but with my priest and I, although he remained chaste until his passing, we were committing adultery for 8 years. We believed that the love was pure, our thoughts were not always. We also knew that it was wrong and we shouldn’t be anything more than friends, but our love for each other was so strong that we weren’t able to resist one another.
I hope that one day you will be able to relax a bit and enjoy your priest more. Once I let go of all of the man-made rules and outside influences, and stopped worrying about what people thought and concentrated more on being a good human being focused on God’s plan, I was able to just start enjoying loving my priest. I pray that this happens for you too.
One thing that I learned also is that it is important to beware of the wolf in sheep’s clothing that tries to persuade you to abandon your love for your priest and “move on”. I found that these people usually have a hidden agenda based on jealousy. If he is not cruel or abusive to you, just ignore those people. If they care about you, they will support you and give you gentle loving advice and not judge you or try to make you feel worse than you already do.
Keep your chin up and focus on the good in your priest and in life in general. I will pray for peace and happiness for you.
Love and blessings to you. 💖
B,
I am so happy that you have a loving and reciprocal relationship. I would like very much to read about how you two met and how you handled some of the challenges in your relationship.
LoveAsFire~
I am sorry to have suggested a referral from your physician for you to access therapeutic counseling. I was mistaken thinking you were a woman in peril, despair *and* the priest/monk was over-stepping professional boundaries.
Sometimes when this old Grammie reads from her phone, I get lost among the stories and threads.
My apology~ please guard your heart, though.
~Marshmallow
Rosalie,
Thank you for sharing your story. I appreciate your honesty and openness.
I for one feel we have only just begun to really understand the spirituality of relationship and what our souls are capable of, I believe God wants us to know, to be closer in union with him.
I too, felt drawn to my beloved. It was more than a physical attraction. The whole package of what makes my beloved, is, in my eyes, perfection for me. Not in the sense that I am placing my beloved on a pedestal of some kind. We all have our faults and failures. I have come to love those imperfections as well.
Sometimes when our hands meet or when our knees touch while enjoying a meal together. I feel electricity.
When we are apart, after a certain amount of time. We begin to miss one another, we both have affirmed this. It builds up into a urgency to see one another, talking on the phone helps, to here one another’s voice.
See, I know we both are doing work for our Lord. All of us are! In some capacity. God’s work does come first. It really helps to come together and refresh our love and friendship. So that we may go back out to do the work.
I believe God does have a plan for all of us. Perhaps, we are being brought together in small pockets around the world. Perhaps we will usher in a more genuine reflection of sacred and holy union for God’s people.
I too believe, like father Daniel, that Eve was created to be Adams helpmate or if you like, soulmate.
I am my beloveds, and my beloved is mine.
Again, thank you. Much love and blessing to you.
*I am my beloveds, and my beloved is mine.” Two loving people perfected God’s way!
Hi B,
I can relate to many of the things you said.
That electricity….it was still there after more than 8 years. That sparkle in his eyes that was reserved for when he saw me. The way that even his walk changed when he saw me enter the room. I miss those things so much. The only bad part about that was that if I saw it, surely others saw it too. But no one said anything, perhaps because they to saw the positive change in both of us and knew how much we needed each other and how much stronger and happier we both were.
And despite all of the things that should have kept us apart….me being married when my priest and I met, then my abusive, threatening ex-husband, my beloved being a priest…we found our way to each other. That wasn’t by accident. That was because God planned and designed it that way.
Like you and your beloved, our love for each other enhanced our work for Him. My priest told me that I had made him see the world in a different light and that that was reflected in his ministry. He was happier and in his words, “complete”, and that people noticed a change for the better in him. What a terrific compliment to me to know that because he loved and was loved, his work, (God’s work), and his life was better.
I just wish we could have enjoyed each other longer. But nevertheless, I do sleep easier knowing that I did find my soulmate and so did he.
Cat,
You have experienced love.
Time to teach others. ❤
Great love see's many obstacles. Like I said before, if we are truly Christian…then death is not an end, but a beginning.
1 Thessalonians 4: 13-18
Thanks B. I love Thessalonians. A very good reminder. I know this might sound a bit morbid, but that is one of the readings that I have picked out for my funeral. (The first is Wisdom (4:7-15) ).
Can I ask you what you meant by “Time to teach others”? Is it something more, or do you simply mean by sharing my story and experiences. I have been feeling lately that now that I am getting stronger again, it is the time to follow the example my priest set and give more to others, but I’m struggling a bit with what that might look like.
❤️
Cat,
I do think that your experience could “teach” others. Perhaps a journal to store your thoughts. Then this may or could develop into a book.
There are segments in our writings and processing of this experience with love, that could support others.
It could also teach those who have a very negative and abusive response to a priest being in love.
As discussed above, I believe it was Nikki, who pointed out that negative responses generally come from a source of fear.
Many people fear the unknown. They fear the idea of a married priest.
Even some priests fear the idea.
On another note, no I do not think you are being morbid by choosing the scripture you want read at your funeral. I had a college professor who made us write our own obituary. I have planned plenty of funerals in my life. A person who plans a little before death, helps the living to really reflect and honor our loved one.
Blessing, prayer, and God’s anointing be upon you for the next chapter.
Thanks B,
I do keep a journal and my priest also kept a journal and gave me permission to use his journals however I see fit. Writing a book might be something to consider. You never know who it might help.
Blessings to you B.
Halo B,
thank you for posting! With us it was so at the beginning. Now there is no electricity or something. But he just can’t stop sometimes playing with his feet with my feet or touching my hand when we sit there and talk. He than takes his feet out of the shoes and touches my feet.
lovesafire,
Perhaps, it is his turn to feel the “electricity” or “energy”. Feet and hands generally are ways we are grounded. Perhaps, his feet touching yours is a means of feeling closer, grounded, and an exchange of energy.
There is this “new age” thing called “Earthing”:
The Earth is like a gigantic battery that contains a natural, subtle electric charge—a special kind of energy present in the ground. For safety and stability, most everything in the electrical world is connected to it, whether it is an electric power plant or your refrigerator. That’s what the term “grounded” means.
Being grounded also applies to people. When you are electrically grounded, you feel:
Centered
Solid
Strong
Balanced
Less tense
Less stressed
Overall, you feel good. If you have pain, you have less of it, or maybe none at all, when grounded. Your beloved may feel these things when in touch with you. You can ground yourself by being bare foot outside and just stand and give Glory to God’s creation, perhaps say a prayer of gratitude, but also be intentional.
I can tell you, that this is not “new”. My father taught my mother this in the 50’s. But, there is always someone who thinks they know more or have discovered something new. That is ok. As long as the meaning and intention does not change.
Also, feet for some people are very intimate. Think of biblical times. Ruth uncovered Boaz’s feet. Our Lord washed the disciples feet. Mary perfumed and oiled our Lord’s feet. There is something intimate about feet. 🙂
Peace and Blessings to you and your love.
As I read these posts over the last couple of months, I am noticing not only women struggling with their relationship with a priest or a previous one with a priest, but also trying to understand God’s role and how this relationship fits into their journey toward God
Everyone’s understanding of who God is and why He created us, and the purpose of life varies–so I do my best not to impose my understanding on anyone else– just share it, and if resonates with you fine, if not, that is fine too.
So I was searching my poems, to see if there is one that might help those confused about where God is in all this– I wrote this after I came to hate my priest and was struggled on trying to figure out why I had loved me, was it from God, was it not, etc— and this poem was born out that struggle
You Are There
I walk alone on a darkened road with endless miles before me
I see no signs, I hear no sound, there are no clues to guide me.
My pace grows weary, my heart faints, my breath labors for rest
And just when I think I cannot take another step,
You are there Lord, yet again, to carry me in your faithfulness
Sometimes I forget your promises , and I keep asking you why
Sometimes I don’t understand your reasons, or your silent replies
Sometimes I beg for answers to aid me in my quest
And just when I think I cannot endure another no,
You are there Lord, yet again, to acknowledge me in your faithfulness.
Your love for me is beyond my comprehension
Your means is beyond my hope
So I will wait for You in good times, I will wait for You in distress
Remembering when I am confused about what I can trust
You’ll be there Lord, yet again, with your unending faithfulness.
* that should read I struggled to figure out why I had loved him– not me–
Beautiful.
Just no chasing a man after he has made it clear that he doesn’t want to commit and have a relationship. Dignity and self respect, Ladies!!!!
Yep, I agree! You are “Made For More”.
Too many of the priests brought into this blog and who are rambling about the world want the attention of women but nothing else. Don’t fall for it!
They have been *taught* that they are the pinnacle of Catholics on earth, “Alter Christus”, and too many take that into all areas of their life; believing they have a *right* to treat us as they determine. To insulate their celebrity.
A *heady* notion that has corrupted the Church, propelled the horrific abuse of children and other criminal actions, deceived their flock and brought immeasurable pain to women who they have led to believe they love.
As Broken Heart and Promise Can write: “Give it up to God and live in the lens of His love.”
God Bless You All… I love each and every one of you; we are first and foremost, Sisters Of Faith; and secondly, the collateral damage of undeserving men.
I want only the best for each of you, and I want each of you to want the best for Y O U!
~Marshmallow
Paula, what you said here, reminded me of this verse:
Song of Solomon 8:4
Daughters of Jerusalem, I charge you: Do not arouse or awaken love until it so desires.
Shout Out To Cat & Maria P…
We have not seen Cat nor Maria P stop in for quite awhile; does anyone hear personally from them? Maybe Cat is acclimating to life in Poland? And Maria?
I hope they are safe and well… It’s not the same without them!
~Marshmallow
Cat only posted on Jan 25th
Daniel~
A few questions for you, if you will:
~ How long have you had this blog?
~ Do you track data, ie number of feature stories/year, number of comments/feature?
~ And, do you have any success stories from persons who came here heartbroken, but the relationship did grow into “happily after ever”?
~ Have you ever had a positive priest-woman (or priest-man) relationship come onto this blog that was healthy, wholesome and went on to marriage? In addition to yours 🙂
~ And how did you come about doing this blog?
~ Has your wife ever done a feature story? That would be interesting 🙂
Just wondering~ hope I am not over-stepping.
Thanks~
~Marshmallow
I started a blog soon after I left officially the monastery (it was in another url though). Some of my friends kept coming for spiritual needs and I felt that it was God who was asking me to serve them. I never tracked people’s stories. But I do know of some successful love relationships between priests and women. The only problem (as usual), is that they don’t feel the need to share their story. I repeat, I always respect their choice. I would never publish a story against their wish. But I do have more stories where they have confided personal details and events!
Sorry but my wife does not feel comfortable with the computer! In any case she has taught me to value women’s opinion much more today than 20 years ago! That’s why I’m in favour of married priesthood. Although the unmarried priest hears many stories about married people, it’s totally different when you are truly sharing your space (not just a bed) with somebody else 24/7!
I hope I have answered your questions, if not just write again. May God Bless you all!
Thanks, Daniel… twenty years of online ministry is pretty respectable!
Nice commentary about your wife… yes, so very true~ marriage and the *ordinary* functions of daily life wafting between two people under the same roof is much different than being a spectator. No matter how much we love one another.
Thank You For This Ministry & Blessings~
~Marshmallow
Your blog is such a big help to many , especially for those woman who are in pain for loving a priest that need to end . Been reading here since 2016 and now i am back again . This is one of the reason I moved on and accept faster the situation that me and my priest is not really meant to be . We just met but not destined. I thought before that only me had a past with a priest, it makes me felt guilty before and keep on looking into space thinking, that there are so many man in the world why i fall in love with the priest .
Me and my priest has been in a relationship for 1 year and 8 months, we had so much memories together. During our first year we are so very intimate, and all the extra time he had was always given to me or let me say that even he´s so very busy he can still find time to be with me.I know he is a priest but i still allow myself to love him back so much. When we are 1 year and 1 month he was assigned to a province as a parish church and slowly his time was so hectic and so many things he planned for the church and need to do cause he want to be hands-on in everything. Until , we just see each other thrice a week , twice week, once a week until only once a month.
Its so hard for me to have a relationship like that, beacuse i am used to, that we see each other as often as we can before (so that was everyday).Until the relationshipwe had get cold, slowly. When we see each other we cant talk so much beacuse he´s so tired since he need to travel 3 hours one way just to see me and he work so hard in his parish. There are times that i seek attention and time from him , he always respond me “I am busy now love” . I understand him and let him be, but few hours after, i got a message from him that is not supposedly to me , he was sending the wrong message to me saying “I am alone, do you want to come baby?” and got so much calls from him and explanation. I can sense that there is a new one. It leave heartache to me but when he ask apology, I still forgive him beacause i love him that much but still the relationship we had was as cold as ice.
Until i decided to resign from work and had a vacation in other countries for 3 months in order for me to think with peace and to let him go and move on . We still have communication during my first month in Europe but its so rare , he´s always asking how i am and he want me to enjoy” but the emptiness i felt during those days was so painful . i miss him so much and i want to see him. I always message him but he only seen all of those and respond me so rarely. Until my birthday came , no msgs and no calls from him .I felt that he´s starting to ignored me and i tried to be okay with that since i only had one more month left until i will go back to my country. Unfortunately, I thought its easy as that . Ive been depressed and cant stop thinking about him , i love him so much.
I prayed to God, asking a sign. So, i messaged my priest again begging him to stay and if he still love me, he will reply to my messages or just give me a misscall and if he dont love me anymore he will just seen my message and ignore me. And yes, he just seen my msgs and ignored me. It hurts so much cause he just left me hanging. Its so hard to move on in a no closure relationship.
I decided to extend my visa here in europe for another 3 months and uninstall the apps that we used to communicate. Its hard, its painful but i have nothing to do with our situation since he already give up. My family didnt know what i am struggling to , they saw me happy but deep inside i am dying. So i started to watch inspirational videos, spend so much time with friends and get lost to many places, and luckily i found this site. I read so much from here and it motivates me to think that i am not alone in this world having the situation i had .
After 2months of being so sad and lonely (its my 4th months in europe that time), I met a guy who changed me, who gives so much joy and valued me as much as the priest showed to me. He is a foreigner and a citizen here in europe. The funny thought was, we are just neighbor ( like his house was just beside the house of my family in where i stayed), but we just saw each other during my 4th month in europe. Even my family and relatives who lives there didnt know, the person who bought the house beside them was a young , responsible, kind and handsome guy. He is the man in my dreams and nothing to ask for. He is a complete package people say.
During the first met of me and my foreigner we both felt spark that we didnt know why. He´s been single for 9 years and dating so many girls but still end up to “nope” until he met and and he say ” i am the one that he is looking for” , that is where it all start and the rest was history.
Now, i am here in Europe again for the 3rd time and this time i am no longer a tourist. I am now living here permanently with my foreigner. The relationship we had now , is more than the relationship that i prayed for. Destiny really works its way.
God really loves me, And its so true, that God has a better plan for us than we planned for ourselves. Thank you so much for reading . God bless us all.
I found on line a story of how it worked out well for one priest– I don’t know if this has been posted here before, but I thought I would share it for those who like to have a happy ending story for a change– and this story is written by the priest— Sorry I don’t know how to insert it as a direct link, but here’s the address for those interested.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/long_reads/priesthood-catholicism-celibacy-love-religion-a8125086.html
Thank you~ the article is interesting.
When I asked Daniel for any “happily ever after stories” ~ I meant for any commenters on this blog whose relationship with a priest ended in marriage *or* a long-term, loving, respectful, companionable relationship 🙂
As for priests who left the Church to marry: In the USA, 60,000 have done just that since the Second Vatican Council~ a span of 50 years.
In my community, I know of eleven priests who left the Church to marry~ a number of them just after the Council (now in their 80’s and Grandpas) a few from the close of the twentieth century and five who left last year to marry~ younger men (under age 50).
We also have a few clergy that are now Episcopalian and Lutheran pastors who left the Church to marry; changing *flights* to yet minister and have a wife and family.
Such a quandary, no doubt.
~Marshmallow
Looking back, there were a lot of things that showed that my priest would have been a terrible husband. He was a huge workaholic. He cared really only about his life, his schedule, his vocation. He never thought about what I wanted and needed. He didn’t understand women and their needs. He was used to having everyone do what he said and demanded. He wanted to be special and treated as such. He thought he was always right. He was narcistic. He didn’t understand normal life with money and making a living and bills. I dodged a bullet for sure. Of course he did have some good qualities that attracted me to him, but they were few and far between.
I like this quote– “Not everyone will appreciate what you do for them. You have to figure out who’s worth your attention and who’s just taking advantage of you. If your time and energy is misspent on the wrong relationships, or on too many activities that force you to neglect your good relationships, you can end up in a tedious cycle of fleeting friendships, superficial romances that are as thrilling as they are meaningless, and a general sense of wondering why you always seem to be chasing affection.
Choose yourself rather than settle for those who treat you as ordinary. YOU certainly aren’t. Never settle for being someone’s option when you have the potential to be someone’s priority. You are the sum of the people you spend the most time with. If you hang with the wrong people too often, they will bring you down, but if you hang with the right people, they will help you grow into your best self. These people will love all the things about you that others are intimidated by.”
Discussions on married priesthood was likely to be on 2019 synod agenda. Does anyone have any further update on this?
I don’t recall the pope ever stating that “optional celibacy “ is part of his agenda.
More probable is allowing married men to become priests.
And I would hope this includes those who left to marry.
There is always a way around everything, but it can’t feel great for those who want more , but couldn’t find the faith to follow their heart.
Yes, I see leaving as an act of faith, because the love was given from God and the fact never changes that mandatory celibacy is anti -scripture.
IMO , allowing married men under certain criteria, where its suited ,is hypocrisy.
It seems to me that Francis alluded over the years of his pontificate that he was open to the Church exploring optional Celibacy~ on several occasions he spoke of mandated Celibacy as the small (t) tradition~ that it was reversible, and scheduled Celibacy on the 2019 Synod agenda.
I read online (National Catholic Reporter~ either 28 or 29 January 2019) that the American *fraternity* of priests who left to marry had written Francis and offered to return to ministry. No reply.
Then he came out this week with married men would be considered for priesthood in very high shortage areas of the world~ but no mention of former priests now married.
Sadly, the ultimate slap-in-the-face to fine clergy who were forced to choose one vocation/Sacrament over another *and* now continue to be punished. Just imagine what the seasoned, married (previously ordained) priest would bring to the Church? The Church that is in dire need of polishing.
We need to close our wallets to the Church. The *only* language Rome knows.
Hypocrisy, agreed! So much for the *mercy* Francis extols!
~Marshmallow
Going by comments he made in the last few days, Francis seems to be taking a hard line, particularly regarding optional celibacy.
Yes, he was very adamant that he would not seek or support change in the current mandated Celibacy.
He was disappointing on many levels; Francis was slow to speak against the child- raping clergy, and the Bishops who covered it.
But, quick to the draw to shoot an unharnessed, optional married priesthood.
The Church wants to keep women out of the equation, and a priest’s wife would be just too threatening for the Church to continue on its centuries-old misogynist trajectory.
It’s truly difficult for me to remain Catholic~ I feel just too old (and lazy) especially not being in a couple to search-out and change faith communities. “My” former priest did a swell job at tarnishing my belief in both the Church and priesthood; the sex scandal poured on more disillusion, women given no hope to become a voice in the Curia, and now Francis pounding the last nail into the coffin of optional Celibacy. The Church is operating in the twelfth century!
Yuck.
~Marshmallow
See Francis’s Monday declaration that he will not initiate nor support optional celibacy~ I read it in the National Catholic Reporter, and it might be posted here by Mary. But, he WILL back peddle and consider married clergy~ ordination of only older men of proper posture (probably meaning those beyond interests of procreation) for exotic lands having a dire need for priests.
And, of course, Episcopalian and Lutheran clergy~ along with their wives~ are yet welcome to slide on in!
Disappointing *and* with the stingy of duplicity!
No roar from our clergy, though.
~Marshmallow
I wouldn’t waste my one life waiting for it to happen. If my priest won’t leave to marry me, then I leave the relationship.
One thing I have noticed about Francis over the past 5 years is that he often says one thing one day and the next day says or does the opposite thing. And the stuff he says on the airplanes is always off the cuff and this is where he often contradicts himself. So with him, one never really knows what exactly will happen.
Just came across this news this morning..
https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/pope-francis-says-celibacy-not-optional-for-priests-but-talks-of-exceptions-1984540?amp=1&akamai-rum=off
It is just not going to happen. If you want to marry your priest, he is going to have to leave the priesthood.
There is an old saying: “Why buy the cow, when milk is free?” And we only fool ourselves if we believe the clergy are too naïve to think this way.
~Marshmallow
It is a long way off …if ever.
Any that want to leave for love would have left already and put a ring on it.
The love can definitely exist, but the pull to stay is ingrained in them.
I don’t recall any women on this blog whose priest has left his ministry for her.
Most are content to remain in the relationship as he continues in his ministry. If it works for them it works.
That’s not the case for all.
Paula~
Might I add: Clergy are not just the dispenser of Sacraments and the rubrics of Catholicism, but they are to represent, uphold and live-out morals, ethics, honesty and truth~ the essence and embodiment of love.
Keeping a woman on-the-side might be a good thing for the two of them, but it is not in the long view… they are making exceptions that tell us (and especially our children) that it is acceptable to cross-the-line and carve out their own perception of right and wrong.
Sad to say, but this blog has become a platform for normalizing lies, deceit and cheating; not only is this polar opposite to honorable Godly living, but all the praying, blessings and fawning in awe of clandestine and illicit relationships adds more to the hypocrisy.
I have a very unfavorable belief system for this blog, but it is not judgement. It is merely a very sad commentary about living a Christian life *and* wanting the best for women. Being a mistress is not *best* on any account.
Thank you, Paula, for making the stand for truth.
~Marshmallow
Marshmallow,
Clergy are not just the dispenser of Sacraments…I did agree with you…yet today I was updated with the Pope’s teaching and I found out that married priests are going to be simply that!!! See married priests.
Hello PromiseCAN, how can I thank you for your message of Jan. 26 and the prayer you wrote for me to pray? It is perfect as it is and I have prayed it many times today already. [There was no reply box under your message to answer so here I am at the end of the string of messages.]
It is like you were able to discern what I have been experiencing, and my imperfect prayers of surrendering this love to God. But now you have given me the gift of a perfect prayer that says everything I need to say and believe, that lets me surrender my love for my priest to God so that we both do His Holy Will. Not my will but Thine be done.
I copied the prayer and will include it in the notebook I take with me to the Adoration Chapel. Soon I will have it memorized. I cannot find the words to tell you how grateful I am to you for writing this prayer for me, and how thankful I am that Fr. Daniel has this blog that lets us help each other grow spiritually and emotionally.
My priest is free to choose love if he wishes as his faculties are permanently suspended two years now and he is retired early but gets a modest pension from the diocese, so in that respect he is still beholden to the bishop. He can ask for laicization if he wishes. The obstacle as I saw it when he went into the deep freeze was his incredible fear of LOVE, the emotions of love, and another fear of what his friends who are still priests would think of him if he chose love instead of remaining one of the boys in his small “support” group, which does not consist of priests who would be called “holy men of God” by parishioners, but are instead some older guys who have lax attitudes about a lot of Church teachings.
So I will pray the prayer you wrote for me many times a day, and if I awake in the night to pray for him, as the Holy Spirit often causes me to do, I will also pray this treasure of a prayer, a beautiful gift from you!
Merci beaucoup!
Brokenheart
I am glad it was useful. I have been one of the Lord’s intercessors for years and the Holy Spirit has taught me over that time on how to pray more in the will of God rather than to try to move God’s will to my way of thinking or to ask for things that are out of His character to do.
God always hears and answers prayers– His answer will come in four ways– Yes, No, Not yet, or I have a better idea— the yes and no answers are usually direct and quick– the not yet, or I have a better idea are the ones that require some faith and trust– so when you didn’t get an immediate sense of yes or no to your prayer, I suspected your answer was going to be in the not yet or I have a better idea form– so the prayer I shared opens it up to include those answers—and it will be less frustrating for you because when we are waiting just for a yes or no– God’s silence can be misunderstood as not listening or not caring
So thank you for letting me know that help– I truly hope in your case, the answer will be a not yet– and will be in this lifetime– yet, whatever the outcome, God will heal your broken heart, of that I am certain.
Thank you again PromiseCAN. I have been praying the prayer you wrote for me every day now and will continue to do so. You are correct that I never got a direct YES or NO answer from God, and what I get is a “just be patient and keep praying for his conversion (from sin) ” answer. So apparently God has something in store for both me and him. Whether it is just for me to engage in intense intercessory prayer for him, or to be together with him again, I will accept either answer.
I surrender my love for him daily to God, first thing in the morning. I ask Our Lord each day to show me how to pray for him that day. And I’ve lost track of the times the Holy Spirit has awakened me in the middle of the night to pray for him. I get up and pray and then am nudged to go back to bed and I instantly and peacefully fall back to sleep, and always wake up in the morning rested.
This is where God has me now. And I have complete trust in Jesus, each day surrendering myself totally to Him to know and do His holy will for me.
Blessings to you PromiseCAN and all of my friends on this blog, which has been and continues to be so very helpful to me.
Brokenheart
Bear with me, this might seem off topic but it is not
Below are the lyrics from a song in the movie musical Oliver. The character Nancy is in love with Bill a criminal and over all nasty man. Shortly after the character Nancy sings this song, Bill murders her.
This is a work of fiction yet it illustrates beautifully how our beliefs are shape by our desire for meaning. For this character meaning for her was feeling like she has a reason for being– that she had a purpose– for her, loving Bill gave her life meaning– she felt needed– and because she felt needed she stubbornly held onto her idea she was in love with Bill, even when Bill treated her like nothing. And although a work of fiction, the writer of this song either knew someone or knew of someone like Nancy.
The history of mankind proves many of the things God created for good, used out of God’s good design has ultimately lead to many harmful things. Like the opium poppy flower, which God created for a good purpose. And that purpose was the sap of this flower is opium, and in small doses for a short amount of time- was excellent for pain management– but used too long, or for just for pleasure lead to addiction– Did God create addiction? — No, the misuse of his poppy plant did. Eventually human beings created their own form opium, not found in nature- more addictive than opium ever was– the substance we call heroin– heroin has killed many people– so can we say, heroin was God’s idea just because it was based on a substance found in a flower He did create?
So can we be so unwise to think after thousands of years in the hands of fallen man that equally harmful ideas haven’t infected our ideas about love? An idea like soul mates? Just something to ponder
As long as he needs me…
Oh, yes, he does need me…
In spite of what you see…
… I’m sure that he needs me.
Who else would love him still
When they’ve been used so ill?
He knows I always will…
As long as he needs me.
I miss him so much when he is gone,
But when he’s near me
I don’t let on…
… The way I feel inside.
The love, I have to hide…
The hell! I’ve gone my pride
As long as he needs me.
He doesn’t say the things he should.
He acts the way he thinks he should.
But all the same,
I’ll play
This game
His way.
As long as he needs me…
I know where I must be.
I’ll cling on steadfastly…
As long as he needs me.
As long as life is long…
I’ll love him right or wrong,
And somehow, I’ll be strong…
As long as he needs me.
If you are lonely
Then you will know…
When someone needs you,
You love them so.
I won’t betray his trust…
Though people say I must.
I’ve got to stay true, just
As long as he needs me
Is this poem meant to be tongue-in-cheek? I hope so, otherwise it surely sells a woman short.
~Marshmallow
If you read my whole comment I made it clear that these are the lyrics to a song in the movie musical Oliver written by Lionel Bart called As Long As He Needs Me.
I explained my reasoning for sharing it– to show how if you believe something to be true it will be true for you, but it doesn’t make it best for you — our beliefs are shape by our thoughts, our thoughts affect our emotions, and our emotions affect our behavior– the our behavior affects our thoughts– it like a cycle where one will always affect the other.
I thought the song illustrate perfectly how someone’s belief about love affected their choices. The character in this movie stayed with an abusive man, who eventually killed her because she believed loving him gave her a purpose.
My hope was people will understand the “emotion” we call love isn’t just a matter of the heart but as the mind as well.
Promise Can~
My comment was not about your writing. It was strictly me, not fully grasping your message.
My apology for any misunderstanding, and thank you for the explanation.
~Marshmallow
Daniel~
Thank you for the article from the Jesuit publication, America. It is very informative on many accounts; I hope others read it. Scholarly, like most Jesuits.
Yep, married men as priests~ *but* only in “far, far away places”, and as you note, strictly for Mass, Confession and Anointing; no pastoral or leadership role; not an assignment where wife and/or a family will be visible.
Also I found interesting is the call of “older” men. I suspect Francis does not want any young couple in the “baby-making” stage of life~ too familial! And the difference in shepherding from a married priest with chillies bouncing around the church and rectory!
Such contrived hype from the Pope~ a pro-life, pro-family Church taking exception to these very tenets when it comes to married priesthood.
I swear that Francis is full of bologna; a real schmoozer. I often wonder what lines he fed women over his life as a priest! (Like JP II who theologians claim had very serious women throughout his priesthood~ including as Pope hosting her at Gandolfo and skiing together in the Alps.)
It is exhausting, the darned hierarchal Church!
~Marshmallow
Yes it is disappointing. As a married laicised priest, I would love to be able to dispense the sacraments again, even as a simplex priest without a preaching, pastoral or leadership role. I have resigned myself to the fact that it just isn’t going to happen. We are seen as deserters and as being untrustworthy. I can understand that point of view. However, sometimes laws can become ends in themselves and help rather than hinder. Celibacy is a charism and one wonders if mandating it for ordained ministry in every instance is a tad too rigid.
Correction: hinder rather than help
Aontumha~
I am sorry the Church has taken such a harsh stance toward its clergy who left to marry. A harshness that is contrary to especially God *and* Francis’s call for mercy.
As you noted: “we are seen as deserters and as being untrustworthy”. No clergy have been guilty of desertion and as untrustworthy as are all the priests who have raped, sodomized and tortured children *and* who continue to use and sometimes abusing women to have their needs met behind the altar~ made entirely possible by clerical brotherhood and the Church’ s complicity along its entire food chain.
Decades of deserting the Church’s own (the very people of God) and its immeasurable practice of enabling both deceit and crime with cover-up. Reducing our married clergy to less than this is unconscionable; it calls for the laity to protest.
To the all of you priests out there who also loved the Church, ministry and who, too, were
subjected to clerical thought reform I say and left to marry the love of your life:
You are the vision Christ gave to us. And it is you who are the noble clergy worthy of our love, respect and inclusiveness in active ministry~ now more than ever.
These other priests who reinvent the rule of celibacy and continue on in ministry leading double lives are the very stumbling block to married priesthood~ because it is they who have their cake, and eat it, too. Not very Christ-like~ to the people of God they serve or the woman they *keep*.
And yes, there have been discussions here RE: Chastity is a charism to which few are called. It is so apparent, yet the hierarchy is deaf and blind to this reality.
The ache in your heart is seen through your words, I am sorry for this treatment~ what a gift you would be to active ministry. May God Bless You.
~Marshmallow
Thanks very much Marsh Mallow for your insightful comments and empathic, kind words. It’s great to know that the church still has sensitive,intelligent, caring and Christian people like you. God bless you. Indeed there is hope.
Amen!
To continue the thought I had in my response to Marsh Mallow I would challenge anyone out there who is soooo in love to write a list of why they love this person– and this goes for any man/woman, not just a priest– After you have the list, look at it, does it contain a lot me or I statements. For example He makes me feel beautiful, I feel safe in his presence, he listens to me, he makes me feel sexy-he cares for me—or like the character in the song I mentioned earlier– he needs me– if most of things on the list about you– what happens if someone comes along and they make you feel even sexier, beautiful or needed?
If your list contains things like he is handsome, he is strong, he is rich, he is powerful, he is ambitious— then ask yourself what happens to your love if he loses those things– he is in car crash and his handsome face is damaged– he gets old and weak, he loses his money- then what?
If the list contains traits he possesses– he is kind to animals, he is generous, he is affectionate- he loves music– he is wise—etc– then ask yourself do you have evidence to support your belief he possesses these qualities —what has he ever done to convince you he has those qualities? If you asked your friends and family, would they say he has the same qualities? Do have any evidence to prove he will always have these qualities– ie. if one thing on your list was I love him because he loves dogs, what happens if a dog bites him and suddenly he no longer loves dogs?
Then write a list of the things you don’t like about him– and if you say there isn’t anything you don’t like, that right there is BIG RED FLAG—no one is perfect there has to be something you don’t like– after you have that list ask yourself do you think you can change those things? Do you believe if he loves you he should be willing to change those things? Do you believe he will change with time? Do you think you just have to put up it and resent those things?
And the point of this exercise is to understand there are reasons behind your feelings. Because the other man made notion I hear a lot on this blog not from God is “the heart wants what it wants” as if there is no choice in the matter– but your wants are shaped by your beliefs and your thoughts– you know why your heart wants what it wants– if you take time to figure it out– and if you are truly going to love someone –then you owe to yourself, and to this person you claim to love, to understand your own motivation and reasoning. And if they say they love you– get them to do the same thing– make sure you understand why he loves you, or why he thinks he loves you.
I am not against emotion–God has them, so we have them, but they are to work hand in hand with our minds– our emotions give flavor to our experiences– and depth to life– we have music, art , dance– all of culture because we have feelings. Yet an artist uses his mind, his knowledge of light and shade, color, observing form, etc– to paint a picture, that will express his feeling, and provoke thought and feelings in others– A child can use paint to express the joy throwing paint on paper- but an artist uses his knowledge and skill– to create a masterpiece
Love is the character of God, we are all created to be in the image of God. All love when it is all said and done should be revealing something about God to one and another. So many marriages fail today because of this man made idea that love is a feelings you either have or you don’t have–you fall into love, you fall out of love—this isn’t a reflection of who God is, so I know this falling in and out of love is a man made invention–
I will say this to my dying breath– Love is a choice– real love, true love, love that will last beyond all the superficial things on any list– is something you choose, not feel. When you choose love, and act in love, your feelings will reflect that– but those feelings are NOT LOVE, just the consequence of CHOOSING TO LOVE– and you choose love when you make someone else’s emotional, physical and spiritual well -being as important to you as your own and when this choice reflects the character of God to them and they reflect the character of God to you– this is love–and this love requires work– it is more than what happens between the sheets, more than how he looks at you, more than pretty words.
The sad truth, most in this world settle for a lot less than real love because man made notions of love are lot easier— it is easier to fall in love, to get sweep up with in it, to make wonderful promises at wedding, but know, you don’t have to live up to them, or better yet, don’t have to make any promises or commitments at all, just stay together until you don’t want to be. If God loved us like that, we would be in whole lot of trouble.
Again, just something to ponder
I believe God has lessons in this life for each of us , our journeys are specifically created for each of us through Him, choices to be made , learning along the way , being awakened to love in a most beautiful way . None of us can say they know you’re wrong to feel this love , if God is behind it who are we to judge anyone. All I know is what has been done through me and has brought me to this unimaginable place of peace and love with Jesus is loving my priest and no matter what the outcome is I am truly beyond blessed to have this closeness to God because of it .
Just my thoughts
I hope I wasn’t giving you or anyone else the impression that I was saying it is wrong to love a priest– or judging them for it– because I love my priest and like you by choosing to love him I have grown closer to God and understand God better– if this has been your experience too, I understand how blessed you feel, because I have felt this blessing.
My only concern is when people confuse the feeling of “being in love” with love itself, assuming, the two are the same therefore God is behind any or all feelings of love. There are counterfeits out there– and for a counterfeit to be effective, it has to look and be almost like the real thing– otherwise, it would be obvious it was a fake. And we are definitely living in a day and age if we do not engage our minds, we can easily be mislead.
So discernment is important, which is why in my long winded way, I advise not just relying on how you feel, but trying to understand why you feel it. Our sub conscious has free will too– so what might not seem like a choice is on another level a choice.
However- yes, most certainly, It is totally possible to be “in love” as most understand that to be and to love like God at the same time– the danger is assuming one is the other, for that assumption can lead to harm rather than good. And I do know God wants your good, not to harm you.
I get we were all drawn to this site for the same reason, we love or loved someone who the RCC has told us we should not love and they should not love us– we don’t see how the God we know could be in favor of such a thing that keeps two people who truly want to love each other with God and to be a reflection of God for all to share in that love apart or kept it that love in the dark like a dirty secret. We came here to have our reality validated, our hopes supported and our sorrows understood.
So forgive me if I come across like I am trying to preach– I am not –loving a man who is priest who wants to stay a priest is difficult at the best of times– but if you are solely being swayed by worldly ideas and expectations of what being in love is supposed to look like– then loving a priest will be torture– and I am not saying that to be a kill joy– it is just true.
I understand my words will go in one ear and out the other for some– but like you S, I believe God gives us what we are meant to know, when we are meant to know it– so for those my words are meant for, they will hear what God wanted them to know, for those they are not meant for, well, bless you for reading my long posts
And know all of you help me in my journey — the Holy Spirit has shown me much through your stories– but in the end, it is just nice to know I am not alone. God bless all of you.
“None of us can say they know you’re wrong to feel this love , if God is behind it who are we to judge anyone.” Well said S. We should be more supportive and less judgmental toward those trying to navigate loving a priest (or those priests trying to navigate loving someone).
It is not helpful to tell someone you don’t even know that they should not be feeling something in their heart.
I concur with you S.
I am truly blessed to have my beloved in my life. I am truly blessed to have experienced or in present tense, experiencing love.
This love has given me so much: I have had many lessons in life and my journey has only led to a deeper relationship with Christ.
A more true and wholesome vitality to serve others, not just my beloved, but others FOR Christ.
I have a safe place to just express myself, that safe place being my beloved. Without judgement or worry of abandonment, or my beloved throwing mistakes back into my face.
A intimate, personal, soul to soul expression of Christ’s love.
…that gives me what I need, to continue serving our Lord and His people.
My beloved does not become the object of worship, nor do I become my beloveds object of worship. WE turn one another’s head, eyes, heart, to Christ TOGETHER. FOR this I am so Thankful! !
PS– I just read what I wrote and just want to make it clear S, that sometimes I used the word you, but I was not always referring to you or your situation specifically. Sometimes I was using of the word you more as the metaphorical reference for anyone reading my reply comment to you– but reading it over and thinking about it, I can see that might not be obvious so I hope to avoid any misunderstanding by adding this PS.
Dear Promise CAN,
“Love is a choice– real love, true love, love that will last beyond all the superficial things on any list– is something you choose, not feel.”
I have to respectfully disagree.
What I had with my priest was real love, true love. I did not choose it and I did feel it. I knew from the second I met him that I would love him forever. At no point was there ever a second where I could have made the choice not to love him. In fact there were times when I literally prayed to God to take away my love for him so that it wouldn’t hurt my priest and I so much.
I didn’t choose to walk into that church as a married woman and find my soulmate. It happened because God wanted it to happen. My priest didn’t choose after more than 55 years to all of the sudden love me with all his heart. Again, it’s because God chose this special love for us.
I agree that we have choices in the way we express that love or act upon it. But that kind of love is not a choice to be made by us mere humans.
Cat , I so agree , I too wasn’t looking for him , the first time I saw him with my then husband sitting next to me at church changed me forever. I didn’t understand it, this electrical charge that shot through my body , not anything to do with a sexual attraction but it was clearly an awakening of my soul to his .
And I too was on my knees for months praying and pleading for God to take these feelings from me , I had no control
And then one day I said if this is your will Father please give me strength to endure it , and He has done this and so much more . I know my story is no where near over. I spend so much time with Jesus everyday that I know only good will come of this , the joy will follow the suffering , that’s what God promised and by all that He has done for me and shown me over the years just absolutely strengthens my faith to believe .
Promise Can
Truly no misunderstanding , I know sometimes our hearts here are so filled with emotion , as you said discernment to Gods will is everything and He wants us all to come to Him so Jesus can show us the way to love , with whoever that may be with , but above all that Jesus becomes our truest love .
Do you think for a moment I don’t understand the feeling of love– did you never read my story and if you did how could you think for one damn minute that I don’t get what “being in love” is like– to be walking in a store and suddenly be struck with a knife in my heart remembering I might never see my loved one again and how that thought sucks the air right out of my lungs– that you can believe that I do not know, how his happiness makes my heart sing, or his tears, my heart ache–do you think for a moment I don’t know what it like love with every fiber of my being– to the depths of my soul– because I do, and you don’t have any right to judge me — because you cannot understand what I am saying–you hear what you what to hear- as I told S, my words are meant for those they were meant for, and those who they are not meant for, the seeds I am planting will be pluck out them before they can take root.
But I know I chose to love my priest– chose it every day–not a one time decision, like God, I want to love this man– make it happen– but little by little agreeing with my heart and mind to love him with God, to allow God to share His love my priest with me, to open my mind and heart to love my priest for who he is — without conditions, or expectations– not based on what he does or doesn’t do— I love my priest like God does– and God gives my priest free will to love him, He gives all of us free will to love Him- otherwise He could have just created robots– so if you cannot understand how a God of such free will, would not just put feelings into you, without your consent– then I don’t know the God you speak of– but I am sticking with the God I know, my Lord Jesus Christ, who my soul, heart and mind were truly created for.
S–I read once that said that God would never have it as His will for a married person to fall in love with another person besides their spouse. It is not God’s will. We are not 12 year old girls who are ruled by our emotions and fantasies and romantic nonsense.
Dear Cat,
I gues you ment a love story can be somehow different. I too agree my love does not always feel like choosing. It is to strong. Still I also choose to do so but it is too deep to say I am only choosing. It is there, independent from my will!
@Promise Can
Sorry you got little upset because you think Cat does not understand. I think in this case you do not understand that this love can be so deep and so strong that it simply does not feel like choosing. For sure you choose again and again, agree again and again, take care of how you love again and again and think for the welldoing of the beloved. But in this case I also have to disagree. My love did not feel like choosing. It was there, put deeply in my heart and soul for a reason and can not go away if I would choose it, no it can’t.
Thank you S. 💗
Thank you Loveasfire,
I have to admit I am still reeling from being accused of judging Promise CAN and not being able to understand, and only hearing what I want to hear. And using the words “damn minute”???
I reread my comment several times and I don’t think I deserved to be responded to like that. Just because I disagree doesnt automatically make me wrong and I believe I expressed that respectfully only speaking to my experience and not once judging hers.
Anyway, thank you very much. Your kind words helped to take away some of the sting of hers. ❤💗
Promise CAN,
I was and am hurt by your response to my comment. It seems to me that you read into it much more than I actually said. There is no need to use words like “damn minute”. In my eyes, this is just disrespectful. You didn’t like it when someone used capitals in their comment and I don’t like it when you use that kind of language with me.
You said that I have no right to judge you. You are right, I don’t. And I didn’t. I didn’t even comment on your situation so I don’t understand how you think I was judging you.
When you said I hear what I “what” (I am assuming you meant want) to hear. That’s not a fair statement. I try to read each comment objectively and try to understand what the writer is trying to convey. Your comments are no different.
Perhaps my situation is different from yours and so God deals with me in a different manner.
Not that I owe you an explanation, but shortly before I returned to the church, I was so beaten down from being repeated raped, tortured and threatened by my ex-husband, that I was suicidal. Then my elderly mother disclosed to me that she was being abused by my siblings. I knew that I needed to stay alive to protect her. I was under an incredible amount of pressure just to survive and now I had to keep my Mom safe too. It was my mother that suggested I return to the church saying “You should go back to church. You will love Father _______.” So before I returned to church and met my priest, I gave my heart and soul over to God. I told Him that I am at the end of my rope and I need Him to guide me. And He did. (And my mother was right, from that moment on I did love my priest).
Is it so difficult to believe that God took me over in order to save my life? And whether you choose to believe it or not, He didn’t give me a choice in whether or not I would love my priest. I am very happy about that because I was in not any shape to make wise decisions on my own and He gave me the best gift he could possibly give me – my priest.
So please don’t lash out at me for disagreeing with you. You don’t know me nor do you know my relationship with God. It is not the same as yours is because you and I are not the same.
Nevertheless, even though I am hurt, I will continue to pray for you and for peace for you.
Your words speak to my heart. A balm that was desperately needed. You are right….love is more. More than a feeling. We are made in God’s image. God’s Love is freely given, and unconditional, the depths of that love are unimaginable. I understood your writing and what you mean. I would add, If it was a love from God it would not need to be hidden. What is from God is good, not meant to be hidden.
Jeremiah 17:9, speaks about our own hearts. It is fitting in this instance.
Thank you, Promise can.
I meant to add to Lovie and B , So happy you have this love you have found
God does know what’s best , who is best for us and will show us the way to this person , all we have to do is just listen to God
Thank you S
Promise Can
I hope nothing I said came through to you in any way that upset you , I don’t post on here to hurt anyone’s feelings
Just to give hope , sometimes words can be taken different ways , I think we all know that , I can feel the emotion of what you’re saying and you have my prayers , no one knows our hearts and all we are feeling except for God .
Amen
Oops
Hit send too soon:)
My Amen is especially for Someone from Somewhere.
Couldn’t agree more …Love from God is to be celebrated in the light , not hidden in shadows. The later really isn’t giving Glory to God.
Blessings
Someone from somewhere– oh how happy I was to see you changed your name to reflect who you really are. It is very difficult to convey ideas in a comment section of a blog– my words are so inadequate to the task– but I knew whoever my words were meant for they would hit their mark– my only suggestion, is be careful about taking Scripture out of context to prove a point- remember taking Scripture out of context was one the tactics the devil use when he was tempting Jesus to sin— like anything else God has given us,there is a proper use for God’s Word and an improper use–
Yes Jeremiah 17:9 does speak about the deceitfulness of the human heart, but it also states who can know it? Meaning who can know the condition of any body’s heart– when as human beings we cannot trust our own hearts– then the following verse, 10, God says, He searches the heart of man and tests their minds and gives them the consequence based on what He sees their true choice is– of course already knows the condition of our heart and mind are, but He still searches and tests why?– Free will. If I put cake and liver in front of a child and tell them they can eat whatever they like– I might know they will choose the cake, but that doesn’t stop the child from having free will to choose the liver. There is a difference knowing and telling– God knows our hearts he doesn’t put stuff in there we do.
Again so happy you are being healed– and because of Jesus- what he did for us on the cross, we can have new hearts- hearts made by His precious blood. Such good news for all of us. God bless you.
@S
My comment was directed at Cat– unfortunately the timing of the posts made mine come after yours to hers, so it gave the appearance I was replying to something you wrote– I didn’t even see your reply to her until all our comments passed moderation—so you said nothing to hurt my feelings and you are so right about only God knowing our hearts
I know this, and this is why I do my best to speak in general terms unless invited by someone directly or indirectly to be specific to their circumstance. I do my best not to take any comment personally, assume ill intent or get defensive– I do not my best, not to just react to what I think I read, but take time in prayer to reflect, and compose a response based in love
Unfortunately I loss patience, not with Cat, but with the deceiving spirits of this world, I let them get to me, and instead of responding with love for Cat, I reacted out hurt pride wanting to justify myself, but when our Lord spoke truth, he never tried to defend Himself or the truth when others attacked Him for it . So I do hope Cat will forgive me for lashing out at her like that
@Paula,
Sometimes people can marry for the wrong reasons, in which case the union may not really be God’s will for them.
I’m not referring to difficult times , but two ppl who are not on the same spiritual path.
Sometimes to fulfill and follow the path God intended us to be on, we must move on to our true destiny..God’s plan for our lives.
However I’m not suggesting affairs, but choosing a relationship that brings the greatest glory and honor to God.
Thank you Nikki
Sometimes we can’t know Gods ways but we do know His way is best for us . I’m just so grateful I didn’t and don’t let fear keep me from living the life He planned for me .
I clearly understand the difficulty of *failed* marriages and especially the challenge that can face a couple when terminating a marriage. In the USA, a divorce is often weighed against other factors, ie homes, incomes, pensions, investments with the least not being the children~ all valid reasons that can impede a swift and final divorce.
That said, honoring God must include absolute transparency to one’s spouse should one develop attraction, affection or a physical relationship with another as long as there is a legal and binding marriage~ the new love interest being a priest would have nothing to do with it. As long as one is legally married, the other spouse deserves to be treated with dignity and not discovery via the grapevine.
A “relationship that brings the greatest glory and honor to God” is still an affair. Enshrining it in *honor* is normalizing scriptural and legal disobedience.
~Marshmallow
I meant to include “a relationship that brings the greatest glory and honor to God” can be authentic to those involved, but it is still an affair. Enshrining it in *honor* is normalizing scriptural and legal disobedience.
~Marshmallow
I’m well aware of the American legal system.
When I state I’m not suggesting an affair, that should obviously imply dissolving the marriage.
Even in the Rcc , annulments are recognized as such.
An individual can become a completely different person through many catalysts, to the point they would never be capable to make the same choices again…this includes clergy btw.
So , yes , if a spouse has become spiritually ‘dead’ in a marriage to the extent it’s inhibiting the others spiritual path, then I wholeheartedly believe that is not God’s plan for their life.
The point I was making is yes, it is very often difficult for persons to end marriages, and they drag on despite there no longer being investment, a point taken from my American cultural position~ it was not a measure of anyone’s legal knowledge including yours. I clearly understood you were not promoting adultery.
But amidst this, I was indicating how extra- marital or deceitful relationships can develop, unbeknownst to the spouse or to those to whom one is avowed. Relationships those involved adamantly believe (and justify) the infidelity as an experience bringing great glory and honor to God. A misappropriation of faith and God’s word.
We are reading it here nearly. each. day.
~Marshmallow
A divorce in the USA can take as little as 3 months.
Yet some spend entire lifestimes in a loveless, faithless marriage.
That too is being deceptive and dishonest to oneself and their spouse.
And certainly that union isn’t bringing joy and allowing either individuals to fulfill their God given destiny.
I feel you and I have experienced different kinds of love, nonetheless we have both loved.
Blessings.
I agree, not sharing one’s loveless-ness and having a faithless marriage is not marriage as God designed either~ despite many a marriage was lived-out that way before social acceptance of divorce, the religious paradigm shift away from the fear of divorce and most recently no-fault divorce. I recall my parents (who would now be in their mid-to-late nineties having pillow talk chatting about friends of theirs trapped in love-less marriages.
But, my generation changed all that, and we were the pioneers of divorce-court consumerism!
Every love is different, and I have been enormously loved in my life~ sometimes strictly hormonally-driven! But none-the-less respectful and mutually satisfying.
Until the priest. Oh dear. And to see it vividly re-enacted here is saddening.
I don’t believe our differences in experiencing love are diametrical~ I think it might be our age differences. I am *old* girl for this site!
Blessings to you, too, Nikki~
~Marshmallow
Dear Rosalie,
I loved reading your story. I can relate to it in so many ways.
I have been in a relationship with my priest A. for almost 5 years now. We are definitely soulmates, we know each other with our eyes closed, we know exactly what the other one is thinking just by looking at each other. I never thought a relationship like this could exist.
He is, without a shadow of a doubt, the love of my life. Like you, I believe God puts people in our lives for a purpose (I don’t’ believe in coincidences).
But I struggle every day with the thought that we have been living in sin. I’m ashamed to say that sometimes I get a little angry with God, because I can’t understand what His plans are for me.
I hope you find some comfort here, knowing that we all understand what you’re going through. It helped me a lot to know I’m not the only one loving a priest and that all the women here are somehow connected to each other by prayer.
May God give you hope and know we are here to hear you and support you in any way we can.
Blessings.
Maria
Maria,
Loving a priest is like loving any other person. You have showed him heaven on earth. You shouldn’t feel guilty. Guilty are those persons who apply pressure on young boys who are literally forced to become priests before they reach emotional maturity!
May God Bless you!
Father Daniel,
Thank you for your kind and reasuring words. I can’t express how much they meant to me. Loving God so much makes us scared of hurting Him with our actions.
May God bless you for what you have accomplished with this blog.
Maria
That is my objective in this blog: to eliminate all the brain washing that has been handed down from one generation to another. I can truly tell all readers, that with a woman by my side, she has taught me a lot of practical things in life. Things which were never important in the seminary formation! No wonder that priests run away when they feel so vulnerable in the hands of a woman!
May God Bless you and all the women in a similar situation.
Thank you Maria,
I will put you in my prayers for your relationship. Yes it is the love of my life! I am struggling a lot. I can’t say I always know what he feels or thinks…. but we talked about it recently. He is now ready to meet regularly again and wants to visit me soon. We were arguing with each other. He was Ill and blind through a virus…. I did not know that and was arguing with him not answering my whatsapp and emails…for a whole of a month! I was so shocked I somehow got aggressive….. I thought about him abandonnig me! I was so wrong! But now we are fine again 🙂